Quite obviously not a woman, looking at the picture. Hope other people don't think that's a woman.
I'm not a Woman in Tech
401–410 of 621 posts
Re: I'm not a Woman in Tech
#402There's sexism in tech, and to address it you have to call it for what it is. I'm glad her experiences are such that she hasn't encountered these barriers, but other people have, and they need these words and spaces. Take my previous job. Women were objectified on Slack. A woman was groped, though she didn't report it out of concern for the repercussions. In meetings execs, male execs would only address/look at the m…
I think you're missing the point of the article. It's not that these things don't exist, or didn't exist for her -- of course they do. The point seems, to me at least, to be that in order to attempt to actually solve these problems you can't actively (or passively) try to exclude yourself from the people causing them. It's like politics -- if you separate yourself into "us" versus "them", how are you ever supposed to…
I've been in enough of these conversations to know replies like this are just trolling and/or white-noise.
Why NOT separate yourselves into an "us" vs "them"? Why should oppressed people try to "work together" with their oppressors?
If you're so interested the effectiveness of social movements, why haven't you looked at cases like Susan Fowler's to see how little it accomplishes to "work together", or within the system, "to find a solution"?
What rulebook, exactly, should people consult when organizing to stop awful shit from happening? Let us know so we can tell which methods are kosher with you. In the meantime maybe start holding the perpetrators to the same rigorous standard of moral behavior.
Re: I'm not a Woman in Tech
#403My sister was a software engineer. She wasn't ever a part of those women-only developer groups. She just really liked programming. It wasn't a political statement, and I don't think I've ever heard her talk about 'sexism in the workplace' that everyone else seems to love to talk about. She left her engineering job to raise her children. My mother was completely against this move though because my mother (also origina…
Of course your sister should make her own choices, but the pressure on a mom in tech to leave is still absolutely immense. The more of us who tough it out, the better for our daughters.
It would be great if there was more part-time work in tech in general. Seems as though this would be something everyone (mothers, single or married men/women) could benefit from.
Not to be too personal, genuinely curious, what do you hope to gain by 'toughing it out'? A better workplace for your daughters? Or to set an example or something? Coming from someone with a mother who 'toughed it out', I rarely saw my mother growing up, and only really saw her when she became a consultant much later.
Re: I'm not a Woman in Tech
#404Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Well, was this an isolated incident or not? An event that had the implicit backing of the school administration sent a widespread message. Lynching in the wasn't 'widespread', but it's message was. According to this: http://time.com/3703386/jim-crow-lynchings Georgia had 586 total lynchings from 1877 until 1950. That's about 1 per county per generation. > your prior definition: Check usernames.
> An event that had the implicit backing of the school administration sent a widespread message. If you check the thread you'll clearly see my interest wasn't whether discrimination happens at all , it's whether it is to the point of being literally ostracized, as was stated . >> Could you name a two or three so we have some idea what you're talking about? > sure.. Perhaps don't impersonate other people if you don't…
> If you check the thread you'll clearly see my interest wasn't whether discrimination happens at all, it's whether it is to the point of being literally ostracized, as was stated.
You don't think putting the kid who was being 'uppity' in a coma doesn't cause imply ostracization for the others like him? Particularly when there was no repercussions from perceived authority figures?
> Perhaps don't impersonate other people if you don't want to be mistaken for someone else.
It's hard to 'impersonate' on a forum where every post has my username on it. Are you new to the internet or something?
Re: I'm not a Woman in Tech
#405I totally agree with the premise of the article. If the problem is that unconscious bias makes a specific demographic under-represented in an area, industry, award, etc.. then how does making a target-demographic-specific area, quota, award, etc. solve that problem? It just further exacerbates, or even serves to justify, the original bias-- you can continue to perpetuate the original discrimination on the grounds tha…
The policies are better than nothing, because you meet people facing the same biases you do and realize you aren't a lunatic weirdo.
But in my utopia, everyone takes the implicit associations tests, has the courage to take in the parts that make them feel bad about themselves, and starts working on those things.
Re: I'm not a Woman in Tech
#406Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's almost as if segregation adds unnecessary constraints to the lives of the people involved. You'd think people would have figured this out centuries ago, yet we still self-segregate and divide ourselves wherever possible. Shame.
Tribalism seems to be encoded in the genes of every primate species on the planet, so it's not that surprising. In our past, every time a line dividing tribes was erased, we drew a different line. This is just speculation on my part, but the only way we'll achieve cohesion as a species is if/when we encounter intelligent alien life. We'll still be tribal, but at an interplanetary level.
Those damn Japanese ^W Mexicans ^W Martians ^W Klingons ^W Cardassians ^W Borg!
Re: I'm not a Woman in Tech
#407Earlier quoted context omitted.
Sharing opinions is just not "safe" anymore Free speech is dead.
Not dead - you can speak your mind - just you pay a social price to do so. Free speech, even in the most libertarian concept I have doesn't prevent other people's right to criticize your speech - in fact, I'd say it encourages just that. Speak out against stuff you don't like rather than censoring it. Ultimately it's an effect of large, diverse communities and deep political divisions. If you want to have political d…
I agree that it's normal to pay a social price for saying crummy things. I'd argue that the climate of our times is such that even reasonable opinions that conflict with a certain point of view are demonized and punished. We've become ultra sensitive and overbearing as a society.
Re: I'm not a Woman in Tech
#408Earlier quoted context omitted.
> It's like politics -- if you separate yourself into "us" versus "them", how are you ever supposed to work together to find a solution? It's not like that at all. Ideologies exist on a spectrum. And there are some on the extreme ends that are so reprehensible that there's no good reason to find a way to include them in any reasonable dialog. I don't care how hurt someone feels if they can't find a safe space to talk…
Why do these discussions always devolve into talks about punching people or getting punched? I can't get through a day without somebody suggesting violence is the only response to get somebody to think like them. If you don't want these "programs" to exist at the professional level, you have to go all the back to college and high school. You can only continue to treat symptoms through affirmative action, because that…
No, you're missing the part where women leave tech in droves because of the treatment they experience.
Sure, we need to get more women into the pipeline. But we also need to not be pushing them out of the industry because they don't want to be groped, ignored, or otherwise disrespected.
In my experience, every woman I've worked with in tech has been above average or excellent. It's the men I've worked with who are much more variable in skill.
I heard a woman on this phenomenon in a podcast, saying that we'll know we actually reach gender parity when there are women working in tech who are below average in skill. And we're not there yet; women in tech tend to the exceptional. Women who stay are the ones who couldn't imagine doing something else because they're so good at tech.
Re: I'm not a Woman in Tech
#409"You’re victimising me when you do that. You’re indicating that it’s most likely I need special, extra support. Just because I’m female." This is exactly how I felt during my Microsoft internship in 1998 when the internal women's organization, HOPPERS, decided to change their successful "intern buddy" program from opt-in to opt-out. (Well, not really opt-out, because until I got upset with them about it they clearly…
The one advantage I see beyond the traditional self-organization of various diversity groups is that an ERG can do a lot with a non zero amount of money, and influence within the recruiting department. Forced participation is never a good thing when it comes to this type of stuff, but to have the money to send those who do wish to participate to events that help those who feel excluded, to feel included is certainly…
What's an ERG? Google isn't showing me any meanings that would make sense in this context.
Re: I'm not a Woman in Tech
#410Earlier quoted context omitted.
Of course your sister should make her own choices, but the pressure on a mom in tech to leave is still absolutely immense. The more of us who tough it out, the better for our daughters.
It would be great if there was more part-time work in tech in general. Seems as though this would be something everyone (mothers, single or married men/women) could benefit from. Not to be too personal, genuinely curious, what do you hope to gain by 'toughing it out'? A better workplace for your daughters? Or to set an example or something? Coming from someone with a mother who 'toughed it out', I rarely saw my mothe…
I enjoy making things with code. I like earning a check. Why do you stay in your job?
It makes me sad to think my kids will think I didn't do enough for them one day, but dads have been working full-time for ages. You're not the first person who has pressured me to go part-time, either.