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China's bloggers, filmmakers feel chill of internet crackdown

reuters.com

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Re: China's bloggers, filmmakers feel chill of internet crackdown

#21

Post by cinquemb »

visarga wrote: post #12
odiroot wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They care about social harmony. Don't want to make people upset. That's the official version. It's most probably about rejecting the influences from the West, preservation of Chinese culture. Recently there's also quite a huge war on influence of Korean culture.

Just as Fox News won't tell the truth, and hold on to their line even in the face of evidence, so do the Chinese. Most of us are guilty of not trying to be inclusive enough with other people and prefer to live in our little bubble. There is always a cost for that - just look at what happened in 2016-17.

I don't know, I think it might be more beneficial for those who can accurately observe the political cirque de jour in whatever locale (opposed to being caught up in it) to engage amongst themselves, than trying engage with those who belief systems are dominated by a particular local/flavor (unless such engagement is exploiting another particulars beliefs against another for some gain).

Said another way a bit more reductionist, it seems that any engagement between CNN vs Fox types is rather marginal (for expected outcomes), vs playing both sides and exploiting the cognitive dissonance/norms differential between the two.

I think this chapter in human nature could be described as a conundrum that arises from the allegory of the cave.

Re: China's bloggers, filmmakers feel chill of internet crackdown

#22

Post by netcan »

AznHisoka wrote: post #3

Newbie question but what is China's rationale for their internet censorship and firewall? What are they afraid of?

The concept they use is “social harmony.”

This is a sort of shorthand for discouraging people from developing strong, dissident, aberrant or divisive political positions. Discouraging people from taking on political identities in general, other than a unified chinese identity. Discouraging people from disparaging and/or distrusting the government. Keeping fringey social trends out of the mainstream.

If you think of how strong political identities are currently in the US, this is exactly what they are trying to prevent. They want to keep everyone on the same page in terms of political and social norms.

The skeptical take is that the CCP is protecting itself from popular and democratic revolutionary movements.

Re: China's bloggers, filmmakers feel chill of internet crackdown

#24

Post by opportune »

j7ake wrote: post #14
kristofferR wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sweden isn't socialist at all, it's a social democracy. Social democracies do not aim at making means of production a common good.

I think the confusion is that socialism is used to refer both the economic policies as well as political policies, which are actually orthogonal to each other.. In the case of China it is socialism in political policies but very capitalist in economic policies. Sweden is socialism in the economic sense but politically it values freedom much more than China , you will see this if you notice the differences in tax rate…

Socialism is about collective ownership of industry. It has nothing to do with tax rates. The source of this misconception is likely decades of misinformation spouted by ahem certain American political groups that wanted to keep taxes low.

Re: China's bloggers, filmmakers feel chill of internet crackdown

#25

Post by mistermann »

nickrio wrote: post #15
visarga wrote: post #9

Probably not Xi's problem but China will lag economically and creatively because of this restriction. It's just ceding the entertainment initiative to other creators, outside of China. Even if they ban all creative content from outside China, don't they know that a terabyte HDD can hold enough movies to last for a year, and be copied easily?

Ha! CCP don't give any shit about creativity . They want to be in control, including controlling creativity. In fact, if you're a Chinese people like me, you probably learned CCP's "Three Represents" when you in mid school. Which is: - "Represents advanced social productive forces" stands for economic production - "Represents the progressive course of China's advanced culture" stands for cultural development - "Repre…

Well, it certainly seems to be working, as most western countries seem to be coming apart at the seams, China continues its breathtaking transformation.

Re: China's bloggers, filmmakers feel chill of internet crackdown

#26

Post by mistermann »

netcan wrote: post #22
AznHisoka wrote: post #3

Newbie question but what is China's rationale for their internet censorship and firewall? What are they afraid of?

The concept they use is “social harmony.” This is a sort of shorthand for discouraging people from developing strong, dissident, aberrant or divisive political positions. Discouraging people from taking on political identities in general, other than a unified chinese identity. Discouraging people from disparaging and/or distrusting the government. Keeping fringey social trends out of the mainstream. If you think of h…

It doesn't seem like a crazy idea to me at all. Nationalism and solidarity among citizens has always been a great source of unity in countries, but in the last decade or so it seems to become interpreted as a cardinal sin, and has has split several countries down the middle.

If I was leading China I'd most definitely want to keep this sort of bizarre thinking out of my country.

Re: China's bloggers, filmmakers feel chill of internet crackdown

#27

Post by mistermann »

opportune wrote: post #24
j7ake wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the confusion is that socialism is used to refer both the economic policies as well as political policies, which are actually orthogonal to each other.. In the case of China it is socialism in political policies but very capitalist in economic policies. Sweden is socialism in the economic sense but politically it values freedom much more than China , you will see this if you notice the differences in tax rate…

Socialism is about collective ownership of industry. It has nothing to do with tax rates. The source of this misconception is likely decades of misinformation spouted by ahem certain American political groups that wanted to keep taxes low.

I always thought that was communism.

Re: China's bloggers, filmmakers feel chill of internet crackdown

#28

Post by sven-67 »

nickrio wrote: post #15
visarga wrote: post #9

Probably not Xi's problem but China will lag economically and creatively because of this restriction. It's just ceding the entertainment initiative to other creators, outside of China. Even if they ban all creative content from outside China, don't they know that a terabyte HDD can hold enough movies to last for a year, and be copied easily?

Ha! CCP don't give any shit about creativity . They want to be in control, including controlling creativity. In fact, if you're a Chinese people like me, you probably learned CCP's "Three Represents" when you in mid school. Which is: - "Represents advanced social productive forces" stands for economic production - "Represents the progressive course of China's advanced culture" stands for cultural development - "Repre…

Given the ever increasing amount of garbage on the Western internet being pumped into peoples minds 24*7 I find it incredulous that people believe the western internet is an healthy environment that fosters creativity. People including the best in society seem to be spending much more of their time reacting to information overloading their minds. At least the Chinese are doing something about it. The west has it head deep in the sand.

Re: China's bloggers, filmmakers feel chill of internet crackdown

#29

Post by netcan »

mistermann wrote: post #26
netcan wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The concept they use is “social harmony.” This is a sort of shorthand for discouraging people from developing strong, dissident, aberrant or divisive political positions. Discouraging people from taking on political identities in general, other than a unified chinese identity. Discouraging people from disparaging and/or distrusting the government. Keeping fringey social trends out of the mainstream. If you think of h…

It doesn't seem like a crazy idea to me at all. Nationalism and solidarity among citizens has always been a great source of unity in countries, but in the last decade or so it seems to become interpreted as a cardinal sin, and has has split several countries down the middle. If I was leading China I'd most definitely want to keep this sort of bizarre thinking out of my country.

I didn’t mean that literally. The biggest idea that the CCP specifically wants kept out of China is open elections. Anti-nationalism is not really on the radar, and the CCP itself has some anti-nationalist roots from its Marxist heritage.

Re: China's bloggers, filmmakers feel chill of internet crackdown

#30

Post by perlpimp »

netcan wrote: post #22
AznHisoka wrote: post #3

Newbie question but what is China's rationale for their internet censorship and firewall? What are they afraid of?

The concept they use is “social harmony.” This is a sort of shorthand for discouraging people from developing strong, dissident, aberrant or divisive political positions. Discouraging people from taking on political identities in general, other than a unified chinese identity. Discouraging people from disparaging and/or distrusting the government. Keeping fringey social trends out of the mainstream. If you think of h…

China will consider democracy only when the credit bubble pops which will delegitimize the Communist party. Tianamen square was at the inflection point when Investment flooded into corrupt post maoist china, democratic movement was everywhere but was quashed by increasingly belligerent communists apparatchiks.
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