NYPD is canceling its Palantir contract • Hacker News Board

Re: NYPD is canceling its Palantir contract

#61

Post by colek42 » Sat, Jul 01, 2017, 4:32 AM UTC

rdtsc wrote: post #50

svendisnigh wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The issue with Java/Swing is that it limits development velocity and makes job less appealing for current employees. While HTML5/JS is not without its own problem. Yet using it over a native framework like Swing, enables the development process to leverage external knowledge (Open Source libraries, etc.). This problem is further worsened when your competitors in enterprise Business Intelligence space can leverage tho…

That's not true universally. While there is a hot market for startups based on Angular ( or is React these days?) and microservices or other such things the market for enterprise desktop software is still there. Try writing a serious CAD application in HTML5/JS for example.

I don't think writing a browser based, professional, CAD application is out of the question. Especially with WASM gaining support in modern browsers and WebGL2.

I think this was done a few years ago, but it still amazes me.

http://www.meshlabjs.net/

Re: NYPD is canceling its Palantir contract

#62

Post by obmelvin » Sat, Jul 01, 2017, 4:32 AM UTC

jitl wrote: post #48

svendisnigh wrote: post #13

Palantir has an outdated software stack (Java/Swing). Their genius lied in creating "mythical image" and cleverly overselling it to the less proficient government agencies (apparently NSA was smart enough to see through the ruse). And then in turn sell the "spooky/mysterious" image to bunch of naive Stanford/Berkeley undergrads and convince them to work for peanuts. Sadly in 2017, their tech stack is falling apart, t…

This dig at Palantir’s stack is outright false. A ton of their “products” are modern TypeScript + React UIs over reasonable open-source datastores, and they open-source plenty of stuff from that stack. Check out this React component, which is pretty cool: https://palantir.github.io/react-mosaic/ Plenty more examples here: https://palantir.github.io

Lol. Sure, a good UI is important, but what's even more important is the backend data analytics and that's were palantir is the lacking

Re: NYPD is canceling its Palantir contract

#63

Post by obmelvin » Sat, Jul 01, 2017, 4:35 AM UTC

busterarm wrote: post #41

svendisnigh wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I welcome you to start your next hot startup in 2017 using Swing/Java instead of React/React Native/Node/Ruby/Python/Go/Rust/C++ etc. The merits of the stack are determined by both intrinsic factors and the market. Ignoring the market (remember Palantir is hiring in SV / Palo Alto) you risk alienating potential hires and current employees. [1] Another great example is EHR/EMR market with Mumps etc. [1] https://www.qu…

Prospective employers: If your problems are interesting and we get along well, I will happily work on whatever out-of-fashion tech stack you have that the web development intelligentsia sneer at. And we'll do great things! I had a blast making Wordpress development not suck and it led me down a lot of interesting roads and brand new ideas. These other potential hires who only believe in The One True Stack are silly.

It's not silly to want to use tech stacks that are commonly used instead of learning a stack that won't transfer elsewhere, I.e epic

Re: NYPD is canceling its Palantir contract

#64

Post by linkregister » Sat, Jul 01, 2017, 4:51 AM UTC

xxSparkleSxx wrote: post #51

jitl wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This dig at Palantir’s stack is outright false. A ton of their “products” are modern TypeScript + React UIs over reasonable open-source datastores, and they open-source plenty of stuff from that stack. Check out this React component, which is pretty cool: https://palantir.github.io/react-mosaic/ Plenty more examples here: https://palantir.github.io

Either way, I'd kill myself before I worked at Palanatir. And I've put myself in poverty before by quitting a multi-national pharma that bought my company out and I lived on my 10k savings over 15months while I found a new job. Palanatir is not harming the world because of 4-5 shitty executives. They are harming the world because of 100's of shitty employees that only want money. Fuck all of them.

> They are harming the world because of 100's of shitty employees that only want money.

Can you explain this more? I don't work at Palantir, but I do insist I get paid for working every two weeks.

How are they harming the world? I mean, aside from converting oxygen to carbon dioxide.

Re: NYPD is canceling its Palantir contract

#65

Post by RUTHLESS_RUFUS » Sat, Jul 01, 2017, 4:52 AM UTC

Zigurd wrote: post #24

nitrogen wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Swing isn't actually bad if you have a good look-and-feel. Easier to design a Swing UI than a webapp with similar functionality.

The problem with Swing is that everything in Swing looks like a dog's breakfast and nobody under 40 knows how to use it.

Nobody under 40 knows how to use it, or WANTS to use it? Doesn't take much experience to dink through a few tutorials on yet another GUI paradigm.

Re: NYPD is canceling its Palantir contract

#66

Post by linkregister » Sat, Jul 01, 2017, 4:53 AM UTC

obmelvin wrote: post #63

busterarm wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Prospective employers: If your problems are interesting and we get along well, I will happily work on whatever out-of-fashion tech stack you have that the web development intelligentsia sneer at. And we'll do great things! I had a blast making Wordpress development not suck and it led me down a lot of interesting roads and brand new ideas. These other potential hires who only believe in The One True Stack are silly.

It's not silly to want to use tech stacks that are commonly used instead of learning a stack that won't transfer elsewhere, I.e epic

It's absurd to compare MUMPS with Java. Java is very much used by modern companies on the backend and for desktop applications.

You can still make your SV rockstar programmer salary writing code in Java. Don't they still use it at Google?

Re: NYPD is canceling its Palantir contract

#67

Post by [deleted] » Sat, Jul 01, 2017, 5:00 AM UTC

jitl wrote: post #52

kelukelugames wrote: post #11

How does buzzfeed get the scoop on this? I didn't know they did tech reporting.

The author of this article (William Alden) writes consistently negative headlines about two companies: Palantir and Uber. That’s his beat at Buzzfeed. https://www.buzzfeed.com/williamalden

[deleted]

Re: NYPD is canceling its Palantir contract

#68

Post by quickthrower » Sat, Jul 01, 2017, 5:00 AM UTC

nebabyte wrote: post #58

jitl wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This dig at Palantir’s stack is outright false. A ton of their “products” are modern TypeScript + React UIs over reasonable open-source datastores, and they open-source plenty of stuff from that stack. Check out this React component, which is pretty cool: https://palantir.github.io/react-mosaic/ Plenty more examples here: https://palantir.github.io

> A ton of their “products” are modern TypeScript + React UIs That's... not exactly better, tbh

Not getting this obsession with the tech stack ITT?

You can run a profitable business even when using Java, Typescript and React. Infact choice of language probably makes less difference than us geeks would hooe. Outside of really bad language choices.

Re: NYPD is canceling its Palantir contract

#69

Post by avs733 » Sat, Jul 01, 2017, 5:03 AM UTC

kendallpark wrote: post #14

> The department has created a new system to replace Palantir. > The new system, named Cobalt, is a group of IBM products tied together with NYPD-created software. You really have to wonder about the quality of this internal product. From what I've gleaned about Palantir over the years, they supposedly have one of the hardest dev interview processes. People that work there are on top of their game. My gut feel is tha…

To your edit...(and this is directed at Palantir not you)...

Is anyone surprised that Palantir's spin is about embarrassing levels of image management? That is not just a cultural norm for them, that is their business model.

Re: NYPD is canceling its Palantir contract

#70

Post by quickthrower » Sat, Jul 01, 2017, 5:04 AM UTC

tp3z4u wrote: post #17

jacquesm wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You'd hope the NYPD knows how to set up a firewall and how to detect data exfiltration at that scale.

By backchannel I meant via people. As in the Palantir analyst calls up their friends at the CIA/NSA for help. CIA/NSA data collection remains secret, Palantir justify their expense, and NYPD find the guy. The problem is that you can't reproduce your results. The other problem is the erosion of civil liberties - but I'm only speculating with a thought experiment.

That would be a camera obscura. (As opposed to a PRISM)