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Silicon Valley Women, in Cultural Shift, Frankly Describe Sexual Harassment

nytimes.com

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Re: Silicon Valley Women, in Cultural Shift, Frankly Describe Sexual Harassment

#111

Post by mikeash »

rl3 wrote: post #7

This entire article is a smorgasbord of cringe: > During the recruiting process, Mr. McClure, a founder of 500 Startups and an investor, sent her a Facebook message that read in part, “I was getting confused figuring out whether to hire you or hit on you.” One would think having the phrases "hire you" and "hit on you" in the same sentence when communicating with someone undergoing recruitment at your company would be…

That last part seems to go beyond creepy and into criminal sexual assault territory.

Re: Silicon Valley Women, in Cultural Shift, Frankly Describe Sexual Harassment

#112

Post by api »

BadassFractal wrote: post #56

It's an explosive combination of socially maladjusted nerds who suddenly ended up in positions of power in a location/industry with rather few women for them to influence with that authority + a new wave of progressive women trying to break into a male dominated space. It's going to be a rickety ride for sure. On a personal note, part of me was refusing to believe that someone like the partner at Binary was even poss…

> socially maladjusted nerds who suddenly ended up in positions of power

A lot of people who are socially awkward when they're young work hard to overcome it. Some just naturally grow out of it.

But some find a "trick" to avoid having to overcome it.

The trick is simple: be an asshole. Being an asshole doesn't require any actual social skills, and very few people will challenge you. Most people just go along to get along since they don't want to risk the social cost or spend the energy to raise the issue. It's a great way to superficially escape social awkwardness without having to actually work at it.

Re: Silicon Valley Women, in Cultural Shift, Frankly Describe Sexual Harassment

#113

Post by voidlogic »

ronilan wrote: post #95
dkarl wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think cringe is the wrong word. We cringe when we watch The Office and see people make social mistakes without meaning to. These are not unwitting social mistakes. This is people being assholes because they know they can get away with it. Furthermore, not having met any of these people but speculating based on my experience, I would guess that their motivations go beyond just looking for sex and knowing that one ti…

> This is people being assholes because they know they can get away with it. Nope. These people are being assholes because they ARE assholes. Never attribute to rational decision making what can be attributed to rotten character.

>Nope. These people are being assholes because they ARE assholes.

To be fair, even an asshole may show some restraint when they have a clear understanding of consequences. Thinking their money buys them immunity from consequence is an enabler as they don't believe they have the slightest need for this kind of rational self-interest.

You are both right, an asshole is an asshole as you suggest, but even so, assholes are worse when they think they won't face consequences as the poster your replied to implied.

Re: Silicon Valley Women, in Cultural Shift, Frankly Describe Sexual Harassment

#114

Post by mikeash »

5thaccount wrote: post #19
CydeWeys wrote: post #13

This is a watershed moment in the VC industry. The dam has finally burst, and we're now seeing the establishment of a new norm in which women who are being harassed go public rather than feeling compelled to hide it. Expect to see many men who were operating under the old norms getting ousted.

I expect less VCs to take meetings with women, sadly. Not because they are likely to be problems, quite the opposite I'd wager. That's going to be the rather depressing and sad reality of the shakeout of this.

The good ol' "I don't want to be accused of a crime, so I'll preemptively commit a crime" defense.

I would strongly advise against discriminating against people based on their sex in the course of your business dealings.

Re: Silicon Valley Women, in Cultural Shift, Frankly Describe Sexual Harassment

#115

Post by rokhayakebe »

HN Women. I am a male and I am genuinely curious. Is the following SH or does the position of power the person holds make it SH or does the environment (workplace) make it SH.

"“I was getting confused figuring out whether to hire you or hit on you.”"

Re: Silicon Valley Women, in Cultural Shift, Frankly Describe Sexual Harassment

#116

Post by oh_sigh »

There was a constant murmur(or was it a constant shouting) of hate crimes performed in the name of Trump shortly after the election, but almost all of them turned out to be hoax hate crimes perpetrated by the victims. I'm not saying that is the case with sexism in SV, which certainly exists - I am merely saying that people claiming something usually isn't enough proof alone that something is happening. Of course, you shouldn't treat them as liars automatically, but I don't think you should also just blindly accept what someone or multiple people say. It can be evidence towards a problem though.

Re: Silicon Valley Women, in Cultural Shift, Frankly Describe Sexual Harassment

#117

Post by khazhoux »

tpush wrote: post #82
khazhoux wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Next time you hear "a constant murmur" of harassment, racism, or other bad behaviour, _believe it_. Um, no? There's a constant murmur of racism in SV companies. I haven't seen that at all. In fact, the opposite. Doesn't mean there's no racism, but I'd rather have actual examples before I buy into that line. There's a constant murmur of ageism in tech companies. I haven't seen that either. Plenty of people over 40,…

Believe it or not, there is stuff happening that you are not aware of. If your first reaction to hearing such things is "Well I've never seen it, therefore it probably doesn't exist", maybe some self-reflection is in order.

Thanks for the tip. I didn't realize other stuff happens around me.

But still, there's lots of "constant murmurs" that don't pan out, and in many cases they're driven by agendas. It's easy to make or perpetuate claims when there's no attribution, no specific examples, etc. Just vague innuendos.

So if some vague innuendo is contrary to my personal experience, yeah I won't believe it as fact.

Kudos to these women for bringing VC sexism out of the realm of murmurs.

Re: Silicon Valley Women, in Cultural Shift, Frankly Describe Sexual Harassment

#118

Post by notjack »

ronilan wrote: post #95
dkarl wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think cringe is the wrong word. We cringe when we watch The Office and see people make social mistakes without meaning to. These are not unwitting social mistakes. This is people being assholes because they know they can get away with it. Furthermore, not having met any of these people but speculating based on my experience, I would guess that their motivations go beyond just looking for sex and knowing that one ti…

> This is people being assholes because they know they can get away with it. Nope. These people are being assholes because they ARE assholes. Never attribute to rational decision making what can be attributed to rotten character.

Then why does their behavior disproportionately affect women, who have less power to complain about their behavior? If this were entirely an aspect of their character or personality they'd be an asshole to everyone equally, not opportunistically take advantage of people who have less ability to stop them.

Re: Silicon Valley Women, in Cultural Shift, Frankly Describe Sexual Harassment

#119

Post by rokhayakebe »

api wrote: post #43
rl3 wrote: post #7

This entire article is a smorgasbord of cringe: > During the recruiting process, Mr. McClure, a founder of 500 Startups and an investor, sent her a Facebook message that read in part, “I was getting confused figuring out whether to hire you or hit on you.” One would think having the phrases "hire you" and "hit on you" in the same sentence when communicating with someone undergoing recruitment at your company would be…

I am white and male and the misogyny I've observed in tech has annoyed me . If it annoys me it must be intolerable to women. I believe every word of it and I could tell a few stories of things I've seen. I've seen a lot of other kinds of assholery too. Tech has an underbelly just like any other major industry. FWIW I've heard Hollywood and Wall St. are worse.

Tell one.
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