Sony plans to make vinyl records again • Hacker News Board

Re: Sony plans to make vinyl records again

#241

Post by 11thEarlOfMar » Fri, Jun 30, 2017, 6:13 PM UTC

amartya916 wrote: post #150

bcrescimanno wrote: post #144

As someone who started collecting vinyl about 3 years ago, it's about the difference between passive and active involvement in music. So much of our music consumption these days is a largely passive activity. We have music in our headphones while we work. We have music on in our cars while we drive. We have music on in the background of social events. While modern digital formats have given us true ubiquity of music…

This is very nicely framed, thank you. At the risk of going slightly off track, do you think this argument about active involvement also fits (physical and not electronic)books?

At risk of a bit more off topic, the active vs. passive engagement is why I brought Scrum into my company. Circulating an Excel file with a list of tasks was the passive approach. Pulling your tag off the backlog and moving it forward was the active approach. I told my skeptical management that the physical act of moving tasks through their status changes would make a difference in engagement and all members of the team said they felt more engaged with the project when we went to Scrum.

There is something to be lost in digitizing our lives, automating our activities and putting it all online. Sure, we gain time to do other things, but it seems we then fritter it away scrolling through facebook feeds, tweets and whatnot.

Re: Sony plans to make vinyl records again

#242

Post by aaronarduino » Fri, Jun 30, 2017, 6:14 PM UTC

Symbiote wrote: post #185

aaronarduino wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Better sound quality can be debated endlessly. Although being a part of and having friends in the recording industry for over six years, I can assure you that the consensus is that vinyl does sound better. If a record is pressed well it does sound more pleasing.

Play the vinyl, and record that onto a CD. Now play the CD. You have exactly that "pleasing" sound.

True. Now if only someone would make a vinyl emulation, that would be great.

Re: Sony plans to make vinyl records again

#243

Post by eric_h » Fri, Jun 30, 2017, 6:15 PM UTC

zippergz wrote: post #159

amartya916 wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is very nicely framed, thank you. At the risk of going slightly off track, do you think this argument about active involvement also fits (physical and not electronic)books?

I find that an eInk Kindle is "close enough" to a paper book in terms of immersion for me. But reading on my iPad (or even worse, computer) definitely is not. I get notifications, there's always the temptation to jump out and "just check email," etc. With the Kindle there is no distraction, and for me that seems to be more important than the tactile experience of a printed book (though I do still enjoy printed books)…

Personally I've found that the loss of one spatial dimension in the transition from paper to ebook actually makes the book less engaging and more difficult to retain details.

I think (again, my personal experience) that reading while also having a tactile sense of where I am in the book (say ~20% of the way through) makes it easier to remember smaller details; perhaps the physical book helps my brain create a sort of "memory castle" that a little progress bar on an ebook does not.

One example: I read all but the latest Game of Thrones books in paperback (well before the HBO show was even announced). I devoured them and was able to keep track of all the families/storylines without a problem or a second thought. I tried to read the latest one as an ebook and I found I'd have forgotten details of various storylines between reading sessions. I ultimately never finished it and I'm just watching the TV show now :|

Now when I want to read a book, I buy a book - I just can't get into ebooks. Sure, it's not as convenient, but it also doesn't need to be plugged in, ever.

Re: Sony plans to make vinyl records again

#244

Post by glenneroo » Fri, Jun 30, 2017, 6:15 PM UTC

alkonaut wrote: post #49

eterm wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But why buy vinyl instead of buying CDs? I understand your point about listening to a whole album being preferable to singles, I feel the same way but I'd still much rather listen to a CD than an LP.

I think I can answer that: because vinyl now feels like timeless artifacts while CD's feel disposable and cheap. We thought vinyl was going the way of the dinosaur when the CD came, but now that they are back it feels like they are here to stay. Both vinyl and cds were bought to get the music the first time around. CD had no trouble displacing vinyl for the quality of the sound. But this time, when it's more about th…

I would even say that CDs really are somewhat disposable and cheap, they wear down after ~10 years and you often get scratches which cause your tracks to do the endless looping skip-skip-skip. I don't know how many DJ's I've heard play a scratched/skipping track, whereas Vinyl only skips if your tonearm weight is out of whack, the stage is bouncing, you accidentally bump the turntable (drugs are bad, mmmkay), or something physically gets on your record while it's playing. You can even see where e.g. the quiet sections are on your record, a bonus when mixing if you don't/can't memorize your music.

I've been DJing various Techno genres with Vinyl for ~15 years and I've watched the scene shift towards CD and MP3 devices, yet turntables (Technics SL-1200 or thereabouts) are still almost always guaranteed to be at most dance venues (often with CD-DJs hooked up nearby). I also somehow prefer carrying my music around with me, it forces me to pick out ~50 pieces and then lug them behind me to the event, arriving all sweaty and out of breath because that shit's heavy. But it somehow gives me a sense of accomplishment even before I lay down the first record. And I know that my records will play, as long as the mixer isn't totally destroyed.

Re: Sony plans to make vinyl records again

#245

Post by eanzenberg » Fri, Jun 30, 2017, 6:16 PM UTC

cheeseprocedure wrote: post #212

eanzenberg wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I dunno.. digital music just sounds better, is more consistent, portable, and all around easier to play than vinyl. Why stop there? Do you also churn your own butter, milk your own cows, shave with a straight razor? Personally, I think it's just silly hipster bias.

Due to physical limitations of the medium, mastering the vinyl release of an album is often (usually?) a separate process than mastering the digital version. One of the consequences is less compression/clipping, better dynamic range, etc. for the vinyl version. This can have a huge positive impact on sound quality. You don't have to be a nutbar audiophile to appreciate it, either - you can even hear the difference be…

I think you'll get way more traction spending $ on better headphones/speakers/audio playing equipment and listening to digital than moving over to a turntable and vinyl collection.

Re: Sony plans to make vinyl records again

#246

Post by TylerE » Fri, Jun 30, 2017, 6:18 PM UTC

kazinator wrote: post #192

Frank Zappa on vinyl, BAM (Bay Area Music magazine) [1987]: http://www.afka.net/Articles/1987-01_BAM.htm BAM: Working with a computerized synthesizer, do you find that vinyl is no longer the most desirable way to present your music? Will you be releasing CD-only recordings? FZ: Well, vinyl never really was all that terrific a medium anyway. Some people cling to the belief that vinyl sounds better. I don't know. Not t…

Counterpoint: While I respect him hugely, most of the CDs Zappa mastered himself sound like crap. Super sterile and thin.

People who spend thousands of hours on stage tend to blow their ears out, then they THINK something has no highs and boost high frequencies too much to compensate.

Re: Sony plans to make vinyl records again

#247

Post by tnecniv » Fri, Jun 30, 2017, 6:19 PM UTC

mohaine wrote: post #172

k-mcgrady wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> I don't think most people are actually listening to these. Given the high price of most brand new vinyl I'd be highly surprised if this was true. I do think you're on to something though. I will listen to the digital/streaming version of a record I have much, much more often than the vinyl copy. Usually if it's a new release I'll buy the vinyl, sit down and enjoy it start to finish, and then the only time I'll pla…

I will admit to not actually looking at the prices of vinyl but is it much higher then just a download or much higher then cd/tapes were historically?

A new vinyl album is typically $20 a disk. That's more expensive than a digital album, but a lot of times new vinyls come with download codes for MP3s these days as well.

Re: Sony plans to make vinyl records again

#248

Post by marcosdumay » Fri, Jun 30, 2017, 6:20 PM UTC

eric_h wrote: post #233

marcosdumay wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly, have you looked at your sound system recently? At the time of vinyl, the RIAA had standards on how to process the sound. Those were good standards. On the move to digital we threw them away, and nowadays some companies go into the cheapest route, some go into the best benchmarks route, and nearly no company tries to release a system that sounds good anymore. But vinyl systems still have to follow the RIAA s…

This is quite possibly the first post I have ever read on the internet that mentioned the RIAA with a positive tone. For others, here's a link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RIAA_equalization

I was very surprised when I discovered it :)

Looks like they used to develop all kinds of tech for sound record and playback.

Re: Sony plans to make vinyl records again

#249

Post by protomyth » Fri, Jun 30, 2017, 6:22 PM UTC

kazinator wrote: post #221

Remember, folks. An audiophile is someone who listens to equipment, not music. He can hear the difference between 0.1% THD and 1% THD, but can't tell Mozart from Beethoven, or Kenny G from Coltrane. When people claim about how they are emotionally moved by certain speakers, but not others, chances are the music is shit. When the music is good, I'm still moved by a 64 kb/s encoding using 8 bit uLaw, played through lap…

> When the music is good, I'm still moved by a 64 kb/s encoding using 8 bit uLaw, played through laptop speakers.

I'm not an audiophile, but I disagree with your assertion. I did love going to concerts in the 90's and early 00's. In February of 1993, I saw Stone Temple Pilots opening for Megadeth at the Fargo Civic Memorial Auditorium (not the Fargo Dome, think bigger high school gym). I liked their album, but was pretty much there to see Megadeth.

When I heard STP in concert (an frankly its not the best venue particularly in ND in Feb) including the megaphone in Crackerman, it blew me away. You can feel the range, and I loved their music ever since. I will say that the CD and mp4 are loved because of a memory more than how they sound.

Re: Sony plans to make vinyl records again

#250

Post by nocman » Fri, Jun 30, 2017, 6:22 PM UTC

delinka wrote: post #230

nocman wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I can understand the nostalgia of playing music on a record player (many of us had lots of records when we were younger), and how that experience could be different for you, perhaps in a very pleasant way, I find the idea that the experience of using one medium over another somehow makes you more "serious" about the music (or more engaged with the music, or whatever else you want to call it) is laughable. You c…

"...using one medium over another somehow makes you more "serious" about the music" I believe you missed the point. He says the ritual makes the listener more involved with the music. He doesn't say different media make one more or less serious about music. It's similar with food: you can be serious about your food whether cooking it yourself or ordering it at a restaurant (or eating at a buffet.) But you're more inv…

No, I don't think I missed the point.

My point was that he was unnecessarily tying the listener's activeness/seriousness/whatever with/about the music to the medium it was on.

I totally get the point about there being different levels of interaction with music. I just don't think that listening to music on vinyl equates to you being a more active listener. For some it might help, I suppose, but I think it is far from universal. Also, the implication was (as I read it), that if you listen on vinyl you are tons more likely to be an active listener than someone who is using a more modern medium, and I just don't think that's true.