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Waymo filing says Travis Kalanick knew engineer had Google info

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Re: Waymo filing says Travis Kalanick knew engineer had Google info

#81
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are consequences, but they're more related to the adequacy of Google's basis for making the assertion rather than whether it is ultimately correct or incorrect. Accuracy of representations in filings in federal court is governed by Rule 11: https://www.law.cornell.edu/rules/frcp/rule_11 . Lawyers and their clients can be (and regularly are) sanctioned for violating the rule. The rule enumerates various requirem…

I understand you are a lawyer, but "After further discovery that could turn out to be wrong ... what matters is that there was some factual basis to begin with." does sound, to the lay person, a lot like throwing mud and seeing what sticks.

I guess it depends on how you define "throwing mud and seeing what sticks." To me, that implies a lack of investigation and recklessness as to the truth. "Your honor, the Defendant cheats on his wife! What's my basis for that allegation? I mean, it could be true, so let's depose him and find out!" That will get you sanctioned. In contrast: "Your honor, the Defendant cheats on his wife! We have a hotel maid that saw a woman enter his hotel room while he was traveling on business and leave the next morning." That's a plausible allegation that may or may not turn out to be true, depending on other facts.

Re: Waymo filing says Travis Kalanick knew engineer had Google info

#82

The cherry on top is the history of eugenics in the US, with forced sterilizations extending into the 1970's (!) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugenics_in_the_United_States#... It's a chilling read, not for the faint of heart.

Canada too...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compulsory_sterilization_in_Ca...

Re: Waymo filing says Travis Kalanick knew engineer had Google info

#83
post #11

How long does Uber have left? Another post about Uber from yesterday said they had around a year left of runway. As an aside: Every day for at least the past month an Uber story talking about their failings has dominated Hacker News. I strongly believe that Uber's problems are extremely importantant, and deserve to be on the front page. But, its really tiring to talk about a company that is stumbling every single day…

the mob wants to hear about Uber's problems, the mob upvotes Uber's problems, so there's a lot of content that the mob wants to read on the front page. wait a bit for the topic to cool down. replace the mob with happy users if you wish. disclaimer: i'm a part of the mob, it's a very interesting topic for me.

Uber allowing my & 1000s of others bank accounts to be hacked & money stolen then their PR blaming their users made me join the mob years ago!

Thankfully karma finally intervened!

Re: Waymo filing says Travis Kalanick knew engineer had Google info

#84
post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow, interesting stuff. I have not used Uber for a long time. Lyft is my goto app.

Had there been no Uber, there wouldn't have been Lyft. Uber is not just the first-comer or pioneer but it also fought most of the first-fights with city officials and Taxi unions which actually gave confidence to Lyft for their survival!

Hmmm... from the outside it looked like Lyft forced Uber into the "everybody can drive" business model. Before Lyft, Uber was using licensed Limousine operators. Lyft started this and Uber followed, if I remember correctly.

You are probably right that Uber had all the attention and "fought" more.

Re: Waymo filing says Travis Kalanick knew engineer had Google info

#85
post #79
post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Had there been no Uber, there wouldn't have been Lyft. Uber is not just the first-comer or pioneer but it also fought most of the first-fights with city officials and Taxi unions which actually gave confidence to Lyft for their survival!

Just because Uber fought those fights doesn't mean nobody else could have fought them.

Of course not but they deserve hella credit for this. Also i think with all the major investigation and changes they are doing more than makes up for lot of bad things they did. If anything justice is served and people should move on.

Re: Waymo filing says Travis Kalanick knew engineer had Google info

#86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The myth that you can build a billion-dollar business without some shady dealings needs to die. Startups are usually faced with hard choices if they want to survive. Pretending like Kalanick himself endorsed sexual harassment is ridiculous. We don't know whether he knew, how much he knew, or how involved he was. All evidence points to "the trail of information stopped at HR." I think we like to pretend that startups…

Ironically the sister-post to your parent post complains about a vampire being killed in the 19th century, when it's the same mindset that caused that and that wants to crucify Kalanick. The five-minutes-of-hate culture and public lynching culture is dangerous and has to end. In a year some contrarian will post an article on Medium with the title "Kalanick was unfairly ousted" and it'll be posted on reddit/r/TIL and…

i am against Internet lynching, but there have been enough scandals and just plain toxicity coming out of Uber for several years now.

I know it was not quite your point, but idolizing assholes like Kalanick - "they may be a bit flawed, but they are brilliant businessmen/women", quite prevalent in the US, ends up in a lot of companies run by sociopathic assholes.

Leave the fawning to sycopanthic media, please.

Re: Waymo filing says Travis Kalanick knew engineer had Google info

#88
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just because Uber fought those fights doesn't mean nobody else could have fought them.

Of course not but they deserve hella credit for this. Also i think with all the major investigation and changes they are doing more than makes up for lot of bad things they did. If anything justice is served and people should move on.

How is justice served?

Uber has done a tremendous amount of really shitty things. And for most of it, there has been no "justice" served.

Furthermore, you're taking it as a given that Uber flagrantly violating local laws in order to launch ridesharing is a good thing, but not everybody will agree with that.

Re: Waymo filing says Travis Kalanick knew engineer had Google info

#89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here is the problem, because there is only one of two arguments you can make. 1. He was so inept as CEO that he was unaware of all (it is a big list) the shady things putting the company he was the majority share holder of at risk that he deserves to be fired and have it crash and burn. 2. He was aware of the bulk of the shady things, that makes him complicit. As an endorser of Ubers lager pattern of behavior and ove…

If you have black and white views of the world, you're unlikely to live a nuanced life. Accusations of shillage without evidence also isn't allowed here, for what it's worth. You didn't accuse, but the sentiment is annoying. I think "apologist" is the word you're looking for. Your comment is like fallacy bingo. E.g. false dichotomies are rarely enumerated as "1" and "2", but I suppose that makes it easier to call out…

> If you have black and white views of the world, you're unlikely to live a nuanced life.

There is an old saying that we don't often use any more: "the fish stinks from the head".

On the other side we have this:

https://www.digitaltrends.com/gaming/nintendos-ceo-takes-50-...

Honestly who do you want to work for? Who should we be praising?

I know the choice is clear for me, and one that is very black and white.

Re: Waymo filing says Travis Kalanick knew engineer had Google info

#90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here is the problem, because there is only one of two arguments you can make. 1. He was so inept as CEO that he was unaware of all (it is a big list) the shady things putting the company he was the majority share holder of at risk that he deserves to be fired and have it crash and burn. 2. He was aware of the bulk of the shady things, that makes him complicit. As an endorser of Ubers lager pattern of behavior and ove…

If you have black and white views of the world, you're unlikely to live a nuanced life. Accusations of shillage without evidence also isn't allowed here, for what it's worth. You didn't accuse, but the sentiment is annoying. I think "apologist" is the word you're looking for. Your comment is like fallacy bingo. E.g. false dichotomies are rarely enumerated as "1" and "2", but I suppose that makes it easier to call out…

These defenses don't stand when he is compensated as highly as he is. He also structured the shares in such a way as to maintain control even when selling off parts of the company. If you are going to absorb an oversized portion of the reward and make sure to keep overall control, then you need to accept the responsibility.
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