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How Uber Backers Orchestrated Kalanick’s Ouster as CEO

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Re: How Uber Backers Orchestrated Kalanick’s Ouster as CEO

#141

Post by netsharc »

Marazan wrote: post #90
qb45 wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FWIW, I heard they convinced investors that economy of scales will make their pricing profitable in the future. At least that's what somebody said in this other Uber thread here. Whether their calculations will pan out is another story. Whether such tactics should be allowed - yet another.

What economies of scale? Uber distribute the car maintenance costs onto the drivers - making it the most inefficient way to have a fleet of cars. The Uber model is anti-econonmy-of-scale. It is a non scalable human wave approach.

I suppose the words "pyramid scheme" has been mentioned before... hah, you gotta love the way technology does it, shall we call it Pyramid Scheme 2.0? Promise everyone profits, investors and workers alike, but scam the workers, and maybe there'll be profit for the investors, somewhere in the future.

Re: How Uber Backers Orchestrated Kalanick’s Ouster as CEO

#142

Post by echlebek »

redm wrote: post #138

Just a slightly different perspective from the mob. "The culture at Uber is Toxic." I keep hearing this. Yes, there are clearly some sexual harassment issues, I'm not sure it's systemic. I lived a couple of blocks from Uber's HQ's on 10th/Market and I went to lots of meetups there. People I met were happy and proud of the company. As for the rest of the events, such as Greyball, etc. I don't consider that toxic, I co…

That's a nice sentiment, but I don't see how Uber has changed the world for the better. Has Uber's app decreased pollution or global warming? No. Has Uber's app decreased economic stratification? No. Has Uber's app created jobs? No, those drivers could be regular taxi drivers without Uber. How about gun violence, domestic violence, cancer, diabetes, rape, systemic racism, drug overdose? No, Uber has not improved any of those things. Yet when I imagine a better world, these are the things that come to mind.

Uber makes an app that lets you hail a cab, or lets you drive people around without buying a medallion.

Re: How Uber Backers Orchestrated Kalanick’s Ouster as CEO

#143

Post by burkaman »

redm wrote: post #138

Just a slightly different perspective from the mob. "The culture at Uber is Toxic." I keep hearing this. Yes, there are clearly some sexual harassment issues, I'm not sure it's systemic. I lived a couple of blocks from Uber's HQ's on 10th/Market and I went to lots of meetups there. People I met were happy and proud of the company. As for the rest of the events, such as Greyball, etc. I don't consider that toxic, I co…

What's your opinion of stuff like the Hell app, or intentionally sabotaging competitors?

https://techcrunch.com/2017/04/24/uber-hell-lawsuit/

http://money.cnn.com/2014/08/11/technology/uber-fake-ride-re...

Re: How Uber Backers Orchestrated Kalanick’s Ouster as CEO

#144

Post by redm »

echlebek wrote: post #142
redm wrote: post #138

Just a slightly different perspective from the mob. "The culture at Uber is Toxic." I keep hearing this. Yes, there are clearly some sexual harassment issues, I'm not sure it's systemic. I lived a couple of blocks from Uber's HQ's on 10th/Market and I went to lots of meetups there. People I met were happy and proud of the company. As for the rest of the events, such as Greyball, etc. I don't consider that toxic, I co…

That's a nice sentiment, but I don't see how Uber has changed the world for the better. Has Uber's app decreased pollution or global warming? No. Has Uber's app decreased economic stratification? No. Has Uber's app created jobs? No, those drivers could be regular taxi drivers without Uber. How about gun violence, domestic violence, cancer, diabetes, rape, systemic racism, drug overdose? No, Uber has not improved any…

"Uber makes an app that lets you hail a cab, or lets you drive people around without buying a medallion."

If you used Taxi's for primary transport and now use Uber, it changed your world for the better.

"How about gun violence, domestic violence, cancer, diabetes, rape, systemic racism, drug overdose?"

Those were not part of Uber's goal, it doesn't mean they didn't make the world just a bit better. I could say the same thing about Google or Apple. They have also changed the world but haven't addressed those issues. The difference is there wasn't regulation preventing a Google or an Apple from growing. Uber was challenging a broken system of laws protecting an industry.

Re: How Uber Backers Orchestrated Kalanick’s Ouster as CEO

#145

Post by redm »

burkaman wrote: post #143
redm wrote: post #138

Just a slightly different perspective from the mob. "The culture at Uber is Toxic." I keep hearing this. Yes, there are clearly some sexual harassment issues, I'm not sure it's systemic. I lived a couple of blocks from Uber's HQ's on 10th/Market and I went to lots of meetups there. People I met were happy and proud of the company. As for the rest of the events, such as Greyball, etc. I don't consider that toxic, I co…

What's your opinion of stuff like the Hell app, or intentionally sabotaging competitors? https://techcrunch.com/2017/04/24/uber-hell-lawsuit/ http://money.cnn.com/2014/08/11/technology/uber-fake-ride-re...

That's tough to say, I don't know enough about the entire situation. I think it's safe to say that Lyft and Uber wherein a street fight and were both doing "questionable" things to each other. It reminds me of Thomas Edison sabotaging Tesla, and yet, here we are, on A/C. [1]

[1] http://mentalfloss.com/article/30140/acdc-tesla%E2%80%93edis...

Re: How Uber Backers Orchestrated Kalanick’s Ouster as CEO

#146

Post by jpttsn »

tyingq wrote: post #104
CodeWriter23 wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well he did say there was no way in hell Uber would IPO. What's a poor billionaire to do when faced with an obstinate CEO messin' with their payday? PS the rest of the Uber story is IPO in 5..4..3..

Doesn't an IPO require some actual disclosure of financials in a format accountants would accept? Or is there some way to IPO without outing exactly how much the burn to date has been subsidizing rides?

Not counting fraud, I don't believe there is.

Re: How Uber Backers Orchestrated Kalanick’s Ouster as CEO

#147

Post by burkaman »

redm wrote: post #145
burkaman wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's your opinion of stuff like the Hell app, or intentionally sabotaging competitors? https://techcrunch.com/2017/04/24/uber-hell-lawsuit/ http://money.cnn.com/2014/08/11/technology/uber-fake-ride-re...

That's tough to say, I don't know enough about the entire situation. I think it's safe to say that Lyft and Uber wherein a street fight and were both doing "questionable" things to each other. It reminds me of Thomas Edison sabotaging Tesla, and yet, here we are, on A/C. [1] [1] http://mentalfloss.com/article/30140/acdc-tesla%E2%80%93edis...

I couldn't find any example of similar actions by Lyft, but I could have missed something. Also, it's not just Lyft: https://techcrunch.com/2014/01/24/black-car-competitor-accus...

Regardless of whether anyone else did it, do you think these are examples of Uber making the world a better place and breaking rules that shouldn't exist?

Re: How Uber Backers Orchestrated Kalanick’s Ouster as CEO

#148

Post by btilly »

ethbro wrote: post #133
potatolicious wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm reminded of the Hemingway quote: "How did you go bankrupt?" "Two ways. Gradually, then suddenly." Without diminishing the impact of Susan Fowler's blog post, Uber has already been "going bankrupt" slowly for years before this point. I has been surreal watching this unfold, but I'd hesitate to compare it to the butterfly effect - unless we're talking about many, many butterflies over a long period of time ;) I do…

Isn't part of the butterfly effect narrative that a number of things were already balanced at such a delicate point that they could be tipped?

No, or at least not as originally propounded.

The point of the butterfly effect is that every small input magnifies so much in a chaotic system over time that you won't be able to predict it correctly if you miss any detail, even one so insignificant as a single flap of a single butterfly's wings.

The moral being that a chaotic system is fundamentally unpredictable in detail, and can only be predictable in averages and aggregates. (So we can predict climate, but not weather.)

Re: How Uber Backers Orchestrated Kalanick’s Ouster as CEO

#149

Post by redm »

burkaman wrote: post #147
redm wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's tough to say, I don't know enough about the entire situation. I think it's safe to say that Lyft and Uber wherein a street fight and were both doing "questionable" things to each other. It reminds me of Thomas Edison sabotaging Tesla, and yet, here we are, on A/C. [1] [1] http://mentalfloss.com/article/30140/acdc-tesla%E2%80%93edis...

I couldn't find any example of similar actions by Lyft, but I could have missed something. Also, it's not just Lyft: https://techcrunch.com/2014/01/24/black-car-competitor-accus... Regardless of whether anyone else did it, do you think these are examples of Uber making the world a better place and breaking rules that shouldn't exist?

"Regardless of whether anyone else did it, do you think these are examples of Uber making the world a better place and breaking rules that shouldn't exist?"

You're not really asking a question, you know that anti-competitive behavior is not making the world a better place, it's fighting for market share and dominance.

Anti-competitive behavior is often rewarded in our society with higher profits, valuations, and market dominance. For example, Microsoft forcing PC makers to use Windows 95, or Microsoft using Windows to push IE crush Netscape. Look at Google pushing Chrome via all its products to take 70% market share, much of it from Mozilla, or Google downranking Yelp to push its own products.

Re: How Uber Backers Orchestrated Kalanick’s Ouster as CEO

#150

Post by rockarage »

redm wrote: post #138

Just a slightly different perspective from the mob. "The culture at Uber is Toxic." I keep hearing this. Yes, there are clearly some sexual harassment issues, I'm not sure it's systemic. I lived a couple of blocks from Uber's HQ's on 10th/Market and I went to lots of meetups there. People I met were happy and proud of the company. As for the rest of the events, such as Greyball, etc. I don't consider that toxic, I co…

>>Had Uber not have done that, the lobbyists for the Taxi industry would have kept the status quo.

Uber has lobbyist now, working to change laws to benefit what they want to do, i.e. no fingerprint background checks for drivers in Austin see: https://www.curbed.com/2017/5/18/15657684/uber-lyft-austin-t...

From the above article "nonprofit Texans for Public Justice says the companies has spent more than $2.3 million on an army of 40 lobbyists."

Is it right for Uber to use lobbyists to push for laws that limit background checks?

>>It was Uber, pushing hard, that changed the world, for the better. That's how the world changes, people pushing hard and breaking the rules when they know the rules are wrong.

No, Uber does not care whether rules are right or wrong, does not care about making the world better, it only cares about how things will affect the bottom line, case in point: Uber's behavior in NYC.

We should know by now, that Uber had to make payments for short-changing drivers on pay, companies truly interested in making the world better, don't mistreat their partners see: https://theoutline.com/post/1780/uber-hasnt-changed

In regards to rules, Uber did not pull out of NYC, yet NYC has tougher regulation than Austin. It rarely get’s reported but the only NYC regulation that was changed that helped Uber was allowing drivers to use smartphone apps for ride hailing. The other more expensive regulations remained. Not only do drivers have a relatively expensive background check process, but they also have to pay to register as a driver. All potential drivers are required to take several classes and pass several tests to become professional Taxi drivers. There is literally no legal ride sharing in NYC, all Uber drivers must be professionals. An important part of Uber strategy is winning NYC, NYC does not need Uber. In the end Uber is like most businesses, it is not about making the world better, it is about making lots of money.

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