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Waymo filing says Travis Kalanick knew engineer had Google info

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Re: Waymo filing says Travis Kalanick knew engineer had Google info

#41
post #30

There is a podcast called The Dollop where one person essentially teaches another person about a particular subject. They recently did Uber and it was eye-opening to see just how shady this company has always been. I am not a fan of Uber but after listening to this I will never use them again. Podcast link: http://thedollop.libsyn.com/271-uber

Basically my impression since i first heard about them.

But many pushed them as just good old American "disrupters" of a "stale" market.

That is until the first dirty underwear regarding office shenanigans were aired, and then the twittering classes did a one-eighty in their view of Uber. And from that point on the company has been circling the drain.

Re: Waymo filing says Travis Kalanick knew engineer had Google info

#42
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps for the same reason you didn't mention the possibility of contempt mentioned in the Bloomberg article? There are multiple ways to tell a story. I realize partisans have discovered that yelling at journalists is a great way to distract from the underlying story, but it works better on Sunday shouty shows and swampy blogs.

That is less material to the story than the idea that Kalanick wasn't involved in some conspiracy to steal Waymo's tech. The media wants to propagate the story that Uber and Levandowski were conspiring to steal Waymo's technology, but this makes it clear that it wasn't the case, and if there was theft of secrets, it was Levandowski on his own.

TFA also does a poor job describing Levandowski's departure, leaving out the fact that the court effectively ordered them to do so if he wouldn't play ball.

So far the only thing we actually know is that Levandowski refuses to talk, for which he lost his job.

Re: Waymo filing says Travis Kalanick knew engineer had Google info

#43

Why does this article not mention that when Kalanick found out that Levandowski had this material, he immediately told him that Uber didn't want it, and told him to destroy those discs? The Bloomberg article on this topic said this directly. https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-06-22/ex-uber-c...

"Levandowski, I want you to destroy the discs and also have the driverless car working in six months."

Re: Waymo filing says Travis Kalanick knew engineer had Google info

#44
post #30

There is a podcast called The Dollop where one person essentially teaches another person about a particular subject. They recently did Uber and it was eye-opening to see just how shady this company has always been. I am not a fan of Uber but after listening to this I will never use them again. Podcast link: http://thedollop.libsyn.com/271-uber

Basically my impression since i first heard about them. But many pushed them as just good old American "disrupters" of a "stale" market. That is until the first dirty underwear regarding office shenanigans were aired, and then the twittering classes did a one-eighty in their view of Uber. And from that point on the company has been circling the drain.

I think both are true. Uber paved the way to significant improvements in taxi-ish services. Even traditional taxi services have bumped up their game in the face of actual competition. If at the end of all this we just wind up with Lyft, Uber still deserves some credit there.

With all that being said, I probably won't be happy with the outcome of the lawsuits surrounding the shenanigans either. What will likely happen is Uber will get some hefty fines. But the people who will pay those fines are Uber's customers (and potentially investors). The more focus we can put on criminal and civil penalties for the individuals involved, even if that meant literally every person in the company, the better.

Re: Waymo filing says Travis Kalanick knew engineer had Google info

#45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't overreact. The person you replied to was just expressing frustration with a "sordid saga" and questioned when it will end. It's totally legitimate to feel that way. Conflating it with "stifling" and "limiting" discussion, then suggesting it has a dubious intentions. That's a little dramatic.

Sorry, I wasn't saying that he was stifling or had dubious intentions - I am saying in general , if one is too oft complaining, this could be construed... So, don't overreact to my comment either :-) It wasn't as heated as may have seemed. --- The next unicorn idea is to be able to accurately convey the tone of a sentiment via text.... maybe all text should be "mood text" and have a font color demonstrating the tone/…

That's not a bad idea. We'll just have to write like those LARP people.

thieving_magpie ponders, then blushes. Slowly looking up he whispers "Good idea sam".

Re: Waymo filing says Travis Kalanick knew engineer had Google info

#46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's only the people in tech who know about Uber's problems. All of my friends who aren't in tech don't know anything about Uber's problems and use it regularly. Heck i still use it if the surge is below 1.5 since it's either Uber or Taxi.

> It's only the people in tech who know about Uber's problems. All of my friends who aren't in tech don't know anything about Uber's problems and use it regularly. Kalanick's resignation was literally the top story on the NYTimes homepage for a large chunk of the day yesterday, and it's still on the frontpage today (via a separate piece on the topic). It's not at all just the people in tech who knew about Uber's issu…

> Kalanick's resignation was literally the top story on the NYTimes homepage for a large chunk of the day yesterday, and it's still on the frontpage today (via a separate piece on the topic).

Not all Uber clients are from the States and so do not read the NYTimes daily (and the newspapers around the other parts of the world usually have other more important things to talk about, we also have our own corrupt and nasty business-people).

Case in point, one of my best friends who works as a tech contractor for a big European defense company in the Arabian peninsula (were newspapers like the NYTimes to discuss about these kind of contracts we'd live in a much better world) and who has just praised to me about how wonderful Uber is because anytime when he comes back home (we live in Eastern Europe) it's a thousand times better to pick an Uber car from the airport than to try and put your faith in a taxi.

Re: Waymo filing says Travis Kalanick knew engineer had Google info

#47
post #30

There is a podcast called The Dollop where one person essentially teaches another person about a particular subject. They recently did Uber and it was eye-opening to see just how shady this company has always been. I am not a fan of Uber but after listening to this I will never use them again. Podcast link: http://thedollop.libsyn.com/271-uber

Listening to The Dollop is a great reminder of how entirely fucked up things have been in America in the past. Last lobotomy? 1967. Last "vampire killed" 1892 (or 93). It gives me hope that no matter what madness happens in the present, it has been worse before.

Re: Waymo filing says Travis Kalanick knew engineer had Google info

#48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, I wasn't saying that he was stifling or had dubious intentions - I am saying in general , if one is too oft complaining, this could be construed... So, don't overreact to my comment either :-) It wasn't as heated as may have seemed. --- The next unicorn idea is to be able to accurately convey the tone of a sentiment via text.... maybe all text should be "mood text" and have a font color demonstrating the tone/…

That's not a bad idea. We'll just have to write like those LARP people. thieving_magpie ponders, then blushes. Slowly looking up he whispers "Good idea sam".

amused and lightly impressed/aroused Thank you masculine yet sultry voice

Re: Waymo filing says Travis Kalanick knew engineer had Google info

#49
post #30

There is a podcast called The Dollop where one person essentially teaches another person about a particular subject. They recently did Uber and it was eye-opening to see just how shady this company has always been. I am not a fan of Uber but after listening to this I will never use them again. Podcast link: http://thedollop.libsyn.com/271-uber

Basically my impression since i first heard about them. But many pushed them as just good old American "disrupters" of a "stale" market. That is until the first dirty underwear regarding office shenanigans were aired, and then the twittering classes did a one-eighty in their view of Uber. And from that point on the company has been circling the drain.

The myth that you can build a billion-dollar business without some shady dealings needs to die. Startups are usually faced with hard choices if they want to survive.

Pretending like Kalanick himself endorsed sexual harassment is ridiculous. We don't know whether he knew, how much he knew, or how involved he was. All evidence points to "the trail of information stopped at HR."

I think we like to pretend that startups should be completely moral and make no questionable decisions because of how awful companies have acted in the past. While it's true we shouldn't let history repeat itself, it's false to say that merely disrupting a market is worth criticizing. And this is what disruption looks like.

Balancing morality/ethics with winning is incredibly difficult. You can be an upstanding person, thrust into the CEO chair, and still screw up. Then all of your mistakes are magnified to ridiculous proportions and people claim it's a pattern of behavior that they spotted from the start, but everyone else was too blinded to recognize. Sound familiar? Not even in Uber's case -- it's a story that's repeated itself over and over.

The straightforward response is "Well, startups shouldn't act so disreputably then." I agree that you shouldn't do anything that brings harm to individuals, nor should you ignore a toxic culture at your company. But refusing to even try -- to say that if you're not perfectly honest or perfectly moral, that you shouldn't be allowed to build a company -- is a formula for letting the true snakes dominate the world. Honest people who make mistakes are better than assholes with a thirst for power.

But you have to let them be willing to admit that they've made mistakes. Kalanick has done this.

Re: Waymo filing says Travis Kalanick knew engineer had Google info

#50
post #30

There is a podcast called The Dollop where one person essentially teaches another person about a particular subject. They recently did Uber and it was eye-opening to see just how shady this company has always been. I am not a fan of Uber but after listening to this I will never use them again. Podcast link: http://thedollop.libsyn.com/271-uber

Basically my impression since i first heard about them. But many pushed them as just good old American "disrupters" of a "stale" market. That is until the first dirty underwear regarding office shenanigans were aired, and then the twittering classes did a one-eighty in their view of Uber. And from that point on the company has been circling the drain.

Above and beyond the fray!

Lots of people, even on Twitter, have been skeptical of Über for quite some time.

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