Uber Founder Travis Kalanick Resigns as C.E.O. • Hacker News Board

Re: Uber Founder Travis Kalanick Resigns as C.E.O.

#791

Post by blackrose » Wed, Jun 21, 2017, 4:38 PM UTC

xor1 wrote: post #688

camelite wrote: post #653

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Men hold the vast majority of power in our society. No cards are stacked against them. If you "believe women who report sexual harassment", and more specifically, if you believe women who report sexual harassment in "less clear cut" scenarios than Susan Fowlers, then you are deliberately stacking the deck against the specific men who are accused of sexual harassment, some of whom will invariably be innocent. How mu…

>Men aren't reminded constantly by their culture to do things they don't want to do? Where do you live, because it sounds like paradise to me. blackrose is exclusively thinking of rich and powerful men when framing his argument.

I'm neither rich nor powerful, and I don't feel pressure to do anything outside of ensure my own survival. I mean, I could get a girl pregnant and still have a hell of a lot less to worry about than she does.

[edit: removed paragraph]

Re: Uber Founder Travis Kalanick Resigns as C.E.O.

#792

Post by pdxgene » Wed, Jun 21, 2017, 4:38 PM UTC

davidf18 wrote: post #701

Much of the resistance to Uber (such as laws that were broken, protests) were from entrenched interests. At least where I live in NYC, Uber was dramatically improving customer value while providing innovations that reduced greenhouse gas. It provided completion for the entrenched Yellow Cab monopoly with its very high rates. Sometimes Uber would have higher rates but then you could take a Yellow Cab instead. The Yell…

Say what you want about Uber, but I've never had them refuse to take me to Brooklyn...

Re: Uber Founder Travis Kalanick Resigns as C.E.O.

#793

Post by somebehemoth » Wed, Jun 21, 2017, 4:38 PM UTC

davidf18 wrote: post #768

danans wrote: post #761

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Citation doubly required because if the net miles driven actually increases due to increased use of cars over public transit (very likely), and increased availability of transportation services overall, the greenhouse gas emissions would go _up_ if anything. There are situations where ride services would encourage public transit utilization (last mile services), but I'd guess those are far from the dominant use case.

Have you ever used Uber pool? Two different customers sharing the same vehicle, lowering greenhouse gas. There is absolutely no proof whatsoever, that people sharing a vehicle increases greenhouse gas. Citation is required that it would.

Buses and trains carry a lot more people per trip so the use of Uber pool does not negate the greenhouse gas argument. Uber pool will pollute more than other forms of mass transportation. Uber pool is only a subset of Uber users too.

Re: Uber Founder Travis Kalanick Resigns as C.E.O.

#794

Post by throw2bit » Wed, Jun 21, 2017, 4:39 PM UTC

ransom1538 wrote: post #538

Retric wrote: post #404

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's easy to grow when you sell dollars for 70c each. But, when you suddenly need to sell them for 1.01+$ nobody wants to buy. Uber's problem is taxi companies have lower overhead because among other thing their drivers sometimes get hailed by people at street level. Which means their either taxi prices are lower and people stop using Uber or they pay drivers more and drivers mostly stop working for Uber.

Of course they can be profitable. Uber doesn't have overhead. There are no Uber factories or millions of rotting vehicles in a warehouse. At the core it is a iOS/Android app (4 guys could maintain this), a call center (India), and a law firm (outsource it). They would have to cut their staff, remove the ping pong tables and get real but profitability is there. They are on a land grab.

Call center in India ? But but but ... you guys said Indians are taking jobs away from the US. Why cant business be profitable with call center in the US itself. Greedy corps wants profits, outsource it and then innocent Indian employees gets the flak for it. Just wow !

Re: Uber Founder Travis Kalanick Resigns as C.E.O.

#795

Post by neuromantik8086 » Wed, Jun 21, 2017, 4:41 PM UTC

CPLX wrote: post #770

davidf18 wrote: post #701

Much of the resistance to Uber (such as laws that were broken, protests) were from entrenched interests. At least where I live in NYC, Uber was dramatically improving customer value while providing innovations that reduced greenhouse gas. It provided completion for the entrenched Yellow Cab monopoly with its very high rates. Sometimes Uber would have higher rates but then you could take a Yellow Cab instead. The Yell…

This is factually incorrect. You're drawing a direct parallel between medallion taxis and Uber/Lyft rides, when they are not in fact the same at all. The outer boroughs, and every neighborhood in the city, has had car service options for decades, where you call a phone number (or often walk to a local storefront stand) to get a ride. This is the exact market segment that Uber has entered. Literally. There wasn't and…

Dial 7 ftw.

Re: Uber Founder Travis Kalanick Resigns as C.E.O.

#796

Post by matt4077 » Wed, Jun 21, 2017, 4:43 PM UTC

randoglando wrote: post #629

matt4077 wrote: post #373

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Kalanick is no Steve Jobs, Kalanick is a bro on an ego trip who stumbled upon a business. But harassing women, and all his other flaws, are not what created uber. Steve Jobs' flaws actually served Apple. The worst he's been accused of is driving people hard to achieve the perfection he sought.

You've been praising Steve Jobs throughout this thread, saying his flaws "served" Apple. We don't know that they did. All we know is that they didn't run it into the ground. If we are angry about Kalanick sexually harassing people (as we should be), Steve Jobs mentally/emotionally harassing people is as bad. There is no difference, don't make it seem like it is okay or that it was "good for Apple".

I've been doing saying it all over the thread to nip this idea in the butt that sexual assault is in any way a feature of a successful break-the-rules, disrupt-the establishment startup.

I'm not primarily interest in defending Steve Jobs, although I think his reputation may be a bit overblown, and largely based on a few anecdotes from rather early in his career.

But the repeated reference to him shows how people are equating the two, which is just terribly wrong, at least in as far as it concerns the sexism at Uber.

Because from the stories I know about Jobs, a credible case can indeed be made that he was slavedriver in search of perfection, and that his nastiness contributed to his success.

For Kalanick that may also be true in regards to Uber's repeated trouble with local law regarding employment and licensing. But the sexual harassment charges simply have nothing to do with it,

Re: Uber Founder Travis Kalanick Resigns as C.E.O.

#797

Post by kisil_reboot » Wed, Jun 21, 2017, 4:43 PM UTC

bosie wrote: post #776

davidf18 wrote: post #752

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Err, the cheaper rates were due to uber subsidising rides with VC money, which was unsustainable. Uber also did start a leasing program for drivers. The cheaper rates in NYC which are extremely high compared with the rest of the USA were because there was no $125 / 12 hour lease fee because there were no medallions. Medallion owners would get mortgages (like houses) for the $1.2 million medallions and the high leas…

i don't follow your math. can you expand on the increase. $125 / 12 hour means it is around 12 bucks an hour. if you have 3 rides an hour (don't know if doable), it would increase a single ride by 4 bucks. that doesn't seem the end of the world

At least in downtown San Francisco, many shared rides cost $4 total.

Re: Uber Founder Travis Kalanick Resigns as C.E.O.

#798

Post by erikpukinskis » Wed, Jun 21, 2017, 4:43 PM UTC

Retric wrote: post #404

baby wrote: post #394

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You guys are talking about Uber dying, but I cannot fathom how this is possible from just the user's perspective. Uber seems to be everywhere, people take Ubers or driver for Ubers every day. How could a company this big fail? Stop growing maybe, but going bankrupt and shutting down?

It's easy to grow when you sell dollars for 70c each. But, when you suddenly need to sell them for 1.01+$ nobody wants to buy. Uber's problem is taxi companies have lower overhead because among other thing their drivers sometimes get hailed by people at street level. Which means their either taxi prices are lower and people stop using Uber or they pay drivers more and drivers mostly stop working for Uber.

> taxi companies have lower overhead because among other thing their drivers sometimes get hailed by people at street level

I don't understand why that would decrease overhead?

I also don't understand why the other aspects of overhead (dispatcher, offices, taxi lots) don't add up to more than Uber (whose only cost is servers and support)

Re: Uber Founder Travis Kalanick Resigns as C.E.O.

#799

Post by tanderson92 » Wed, Jun 21, 2017, 4:43 PM UTC

soneca wrote: post #774

davidf18 wrote: post #773

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uber is the largest player by far, so they are an easy target for frustrations and for incumbents. "Uber" is almost a generic term for a iPhone hailable vehicle. Generally, there is market competition for drivers. For example, Lyft for those drivers who are unhappy with Uber. You have stated that in your city, São Paulo, there are 3 good companies. If one company mistreats drivers, they would go to a competing firm a…

That's why I trust capitalism. Its dynamics allowed Uber to create a market, but also keep it in check for bad practices.

Do you think the same about telecom monopolies and the negative externalities of fossil fuel companies?

Re: Uber Founder Travis Kalanick Resigns as C.E.O.

#800

Post by intoverflow2 » Wed, Jun 21, 2017, 4:44 PM UTC

Shanea93 wrote: post #327

smt88 wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We should also believe men, but that isn't a historical problem the way it is for women. As an exercise, ask a few men and women you know if they've ever been harassed or attacked at work. If they didn't report it, ask them why.

Anecdotally, I'm in the process of being sexually harassed by a director at the company I work for and choosing not reporting it. I plan to leave in a couple of months, my startup is in the final stages of closing a seed round - getting in to a sexual harassment lawsuit right now is the last thing I need in terms of stress and career. The power dynamics are significantly different though, I don't feel at all in dange…

> more of an annoyance than anything truly worrying

I'd certainly be pretty worried if someone in a position of power over me was doing anything of the sort. Even if you don't have to worry about the individual literally overpowering you (Which in itself would be a tough thing to prove you were not the aggressor if you are a muscular 6+ footer and had to push off an aggressive advance)