You may want to screen / sort customers based on Attachment style.. it's been found folks with anxious attachment visit the doctor more often and use more resources - but they visit for things that are non-issues, basically they are going for the relationship.
A Pioneer in 'Flat-Fee Primary Care' Had to Close Its Clinics
51–60 of 121 posts
Re: A Pioneer in 'Flat-Fee Primary Care' Had to Close Its Clinics
#52A former travelling companion (on a long distance train trip) moved from Head of R&D for an advertising agency into working in the medical technology industry. After six months or so, he returned to his former job of head of R&D at the advertising agency. When quizzed by the staff at the advertising agency as to why he came back to such a corrupt industry. His comment was that advertising were little children in term…
factor of 10 over what they would sell the same product for to non-health care areas That's a key statement. So these same people charge less for the same product in other fields. Why? The reason has to do with the construction of the healthcare industry. Lots of regulations. Lots of middlemen. Laws designed to destroy innovation. Very little transparency for costs and outcomes.
Why? Because the market will bear it. Simple.
Re: A Pioneer in 'Flat-Fee Primary Care' Had to Close Its Clinics
#53Earlier quoted context omitted.
The free market is a poor model for providing healthcare. In an ideal free market, market forces work to find the optimum price for a product, depending on how much it costs to create the product, and how much people are willing to pay for it. In healthcare, though, how much people are willing to pay for a product is anything , if it's the one thing they need to stay alive, or to reduce chronic pain, etc.
People are willing to pay anything for food or clothes as well. Still, free (well, at least way more free than in case of healthcare) market works decently, at least when it comes to providing cheap and decent food options. The problem with healthcare is the opposite: there is no free market and it's impossible to compete without huge investment and even then it's sometimes still impossible (patents, long approval pe…
"The problem with healthcare is the opposite: there is no free market"
Every other developed nation has less of a free market in health care than the United States, and every other developed nation seems to do better on this front than the United States does.
It could well be that you're right, but the examples of other nations make this an extraordinary claim requiring extraordinary evidence.
Or we could just stop experimenting on our vulnerable populace and just choose a system that works better and adopt that. It may not be perfect, but perfect is the enemy of the good.
Re: A Pioneer in 'Flat-Fee Primary Care' Had to Close Its Clinics
#54Earlier quoted context omitted.
factor of 10 over what they would sell the same product for to non-health care areas That's a key statement. So these same people charge less for the same product in other fields. Why? The reason has to do with the construction of the healthcare industry. Lots of regulations. Lots of middlemen. Laws designed to destroy innovation. Very little transparency for costs and outcomes.
> The reason has to do with the construction of the healthcare industry. Lots of regulations. Lots of middlemen. Laws designed to destroy innovation. Very little transparency for costs and outcomes. Or the reason has to do with the fact that the people that need these treatments are willing to pay any price for it because their life literally depends on it. I don't see why regulations, and laws "designed to destroy i…
> Or the reason has to do with the fact that the people that need these treatments are willing to pay any price for it because their life literally depends on it.
Largely the end user does not pay full price and relies on negotiation by an insurance company.
Have you seen what doctors charge these days? Those are all fake numbers.
Re: A Pioneer in 'Flat-Fee Primary Care' Had to Close Its Clinics
#55Earlier quoted context omitted.
Well, doctors have to go to school for a very long time, especially to specialize. Then they go through residency programs. In all their general education before practicing on their own tends to be about 10 years more than the average American. Which is 10 years less income and 10 years more of expenses/loans. Most specialties cause doctors to be on call. Working in hospitals creates difficult hours. And with all tha…
I find it really interesting that we don't have, for example, a cheaper way of doing front-line health care than teaching people to diagnose every possible ailment. Similarly that that the mechanics of surgery aren't considered a manual skill practicable in a largely assembly line fashion. Apparently, everyone gets artisanal health care, regardless of the level of complication (or not) of their condition. Nothing wro…
> Apparently, everyone gets artisanal health care, regardless of the level of complication (or not) of their condition.
Because biology is complicated.
Re: A Pioneer in 'Flat-Fee Primary Care' Had to Close Its Clinics
#56Earlier quoted context omitted.
Straight up exploitation of people during their most vulnerable moments.
The free market is a poor model for providing healthcare. In an ideal free market, market forces work to find the optimum price for a product, depending on how much it costs to create the product, and how much people are willing to pay for it. In healthcare, though, how much people are willing to pay for a product is anything , if it's the one thing they need to stay alive, or to reduce chronic pain, etc.
Life threatening ailments are very rare. It is not only those that are off the charts expensive.
Negotiation is easier when you have some time to negotiate. Most do.
Re: A Pioneer in 'Flat-Fee Primary Care' Had to Close Its Clinics
#57Earlier quoted context omitted.
Well, doctors have to go to school for a very long time, especially to specialize. Then they go through residency programs. In all their general education before practicing on their own tends to be about 10 years more than the average American. Which is 10 years less income and 10 years more of expenses/loans. Most specialties cause doctors to be on call. Working in hospitals creates difficult hours. And with all tha…
I find it really interesting that we don't have, for example, a cheaper way of doing front-line health care than teaching people to diagnose every possible ailment. Similarly that that the mechanics of surgery aren't considered a manual skill practicable in a largely assembly line fashion. Apparently, everyone gets artisanal health care, regardless of the level of complication (or not) of their condition. Nothing wro…
Generic OTC drugs are healthcare. They often cost ~$3-5 a month. Pretty cheap, available to treat a wide variety of issues.
And increasingly, first contact will not be with an MD or DO (there's several paths, nurse practitioners, physicians assistants, etc).
Re: A Pioneer in 'Flat-Fee Primary Care' Had to Close Its Clinics
#58Earlier quoted context omitted.
The free market is a poor model for providing healthcare. In an ideal free market, market forces work to find the optimum price for a product, depending on how much it costs to create the product, and how much people are willing to pay for it. In healthcare, though, how much people are willing to pay for a product is anything , if it's the one thing they need to stay alive, or to reduce chronic pain, etc.
People are willing to pay anything for food or clothes as well. Still, free (well, at least way more free than in case of healthcare) market works decently, at least when it comes to providing cheap and decent food options. The problem with healthcare is the opposite: there is no free market and it's impossible to compete without huge investment and even then it's sometimes still impossible (patents, long approval pe…
> The problem with healthcare is the opposite: there is no free market
No, it's not; this is evident from all the other countries without free markets in healthcare that provide universal access and equal or better overall outcomes and far less cost (per capita, and even as a share of GDP) than the US, without anything more of a “free market”.
Re: A Pioneer in 'Flat-Fee Primary Care' Had to Close Its Clinics
#59Earlier quoted context omitted.
People are willing to pay anything for food or clothes as well. Still, free (well, at least way more free than in case of healthcare) market works decently, at least when it comes to providing cheap and decent food options. The problem with healthcare is the opposite: there is no free market and it's impossible to compete without huge investment and even then it's sometimes still impossible (patents, long approval pe…
"The problem with healthcare is the opposite: there is no free market" Every other developed nation has less of a free market in health care than the United States, and every other developed nation seems to do better on this front than the United States does. It could well be that you're right, but the examples of other nations make this an extraordinary claim requiring extraordinary evidence. Or we could just stop e…
> Every other developed nation has less of a free market in health care than the United States
Generally what you're referring to is government run healthcare. This isn't "less" free market, it is no free market, (at least for the non-rich). So it's in a different realm.
I can agree that this like infant mortality is much better in a lot of countries. But this doesn't change the the U.S. pretends to have a "market" for medical services when the prices aren't set by government but only by providers and insurance companies. The people who are required to make free markets work, the consumers, have very little power in negotiation. Hence, it's not a free market.
Apples, oranges.
But the free market that we should have will likely never exist given political pressure. Single payer it is.
Re: A Pioneer in 'Flat-Fee Primary Care' Had to Close Its Clinics
#60Earlier quoted context omitted.
1. What percentage of your health issues are "emergency, heart attack RIGHT NOW"-class issues? What percentage of health care spending overall are these issues? 2. Have you or someone you know in the United States ever "shopped around" or otherwise prepared in advance for an emergency through the provision of, say, catastrophic health care insurance, which promises to pay for emergency room visits? (Employer coverage…
If outrageous healthcare costs were only kicking in for life-or-death emergencies then you might have a point. Healthcare costs across the board - except in unregulated, uninsured spheres like plastic surgery, lasik, etc. - are extraordinarily high.
The point he's making is that it's only unfeasible to negotiate when you need treatment this minute.
Therefore a free market system is feasible for everything else. Not that it's what we currently have as you point out.