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Uber rolls out in-app tipping

washingtonpost.com

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Re: Uber rolls out in-app tipping

#251

Post by kelnos »

furioussloth wrote: post #126
djb_hackernews wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The way Uber works now is it incentivizes the driver to give you a poor rating if you don't tip. By including the tip functionality in the app, and preventing the driver from seeing the tip before you are rated, it will remove this incentive. I don't like tipping either but Uber had to do this and I'm confident the data showed it.

I used to tip in cash to avoid the bad rating especially if I am travelling to airport and have heavy luggage. I hate carrying cash and this is a very welcoming change. Anything that would make them look less evil(Although i don't think they are any worse than most companies.) is a good PR move.

I have literally never given an Uber driver a tip -- and have used them for many, many airport trips, and overall have easily taken more than a thousand rides since I joined in early 2012 -- and my rating is currently 4.87.

Perhaps you live in a market where Uber drivers are aggressive about asking for tips, though, which is not the case in SF.

Re: Uber rolls out in-app tipping

#252

Post by johnfn »

homulilly wrote: post #229
whiddershins wrote: post #184

I am so unhappy about this change. I tip well everywhere it is expected, restaurants, bars, cabs etc. I hate the system but it is factored in to the price and there's nothing I can do about it. What I loved about Uber when it started was there was no ambiguity. Prices were predictable, as were wait times. Zero cognitive overhead. No guilt or internal debate. Over time every little thing I loved about Uber was taken a…

This was basically the only reason I ever used Uber instead of Lyft. Now I'll just use Lyft 100% of the time since drivers seem to like them better anyway.

So because Uber added tipping, you'll use Lyft, which has tipping?

Re: Uber rolls out in-app tipping

#253

Post by wutbrodo »

kemitche wrote: post #203
linkregister wrote: post #82

I used to abhor the in-app tipping option in Lyft. But increasingly I would be asked to tip cash by drivers when I used Uber. My rating started to get lower as the cultural expectation to tip cash took hold. It turns out the Lyft model, where the driver doesn't know whether or not the rider tipped, is better for the rider. The rider doesn't have to carry cash in order to avoid getting extorted for a 5-star rating. Ti…

I usually avoid making comments like this, but I'm surprised I had to go down so far to find a mention of Uber's existing tip culture. It's far better for passengers for tipping to be app integrated, and thus optional with less pressure from the driver, rather than Uber's prior system which resulted in many drivers effectively begging for cash tips.

> I usually avoid making comments like this, but I'm surprised I had to go down so far to find a mention of Uber's existing tip culture

This may be because of the markets that HN readers are skewed towards and the fact that they may not have this culture at all. I live in San Francisco, have used Uber for about 5-6 years (since well before UberX), and have probably taken hundreds of rides: I've literally not once ever had a driver ask me for a cash tip, let alone the ridiculous experiences others on this thread are describing of drivers holding your rating hostage until you tip.

Re: Uber rolls out in-app tipping

#254

Post by kalleboo »

Kluny wrote: post #234
djyaz1200 wrote: post #153

Tipping sucks because then the driver wants to build a relationship with me instead of letting me just zone out or check email or something. I don't want to have a single serving friend every time I need to go somewhere.

Don't you just sit in the back if you want to zone out and sit in the front if you want to talk?

I think that's a Lyft policy? As both an Uber and regular taxi rider I always sit in the back seat and drivers always talk to me.

Re: Uber rolls out in-app tipping

#255

Post by wapz »

huhtenberg wrote: post #242
whiddershins wrote: post #184

I am so unhappy about this change. I tip well everywhere it is expected, restaurants, bars, cabs etc. I hate the system but it is factored in to the price and there's nothing I can do about it. What I loved about Uber when it started was there was no ambiguity. Prices were predictable, as were wait times. Zero cognitive overhead. No guilt or internal debate. Over time every little thing I loved about Uber was taken a…

> What if instead of all these nitpicking changes, they kept the fares a bit higher and simply paid the drivers a bit more? Drivers would still yearn and push for tips. It's an established industry practice and drivers assume that most people will tip if asked, so by not asking they are leaving money on the table.

It's really unfortunate how that is the case in the US particularly. I moved to Japan and was shocked at how the service is in Japan compared to the states (particularly restaurants). All the employees work hard to please customers because that's what they're paid to do (and often less than the SF bay area where I'm from). Going back to the US I can feel waiters/waitresses trying to please me to get higher tips or just essentially pretend I don't exist if they think I won't tip well. This arose once when I was playing poker in a casino and only one of the 3 people who ordered drinks tipped. The lady never came back (45 minutes) after that and when the player asked in an agitated voice he was kicked out of the game.

Re: Uber rolls out in-app tipping

#256

Post by wutbrodo »

waqf wrote: post #156
withdavidli wrote: post #145

They're charging teens more?? The people who earn the least if any at all... is there a special teens services that I'm not aware of? And who asked for tipping besides drivers? Hate the concept. Charge us more or split the fare with them better.

Age discrimination: still just fine in America.

Forget allowing "age discrimination": You'd be hard-pressed to find a legal code in the world that doesn't _codify_ "age discrimination" when it comes to the adult/child line. It's honestly stretching the term beyond its common usage to include the child/adult line.

Re: Uber rolls out in-app tipping

#257

Post by kelnos »

throwaway056 wrote: post #178
throwaway055 wrote: post #162

Posting on a throwaway because of tipping stigma. I take close to 1,000 Uber trips per year. The biggest disappointment about this change to me is that I won't be having conversations with Uber drivers anymore. Uber drivers will now be obligated to make pleasant conversation with me. I have no interest in speaking to somebody who's obligated to make pleasant conversation with me. When you add tipping, you're essentia…

As someone who literally works for tips, I've found that I make more tips when I am sincere with guests (of the hotel that I work at).

That makes sense; most people can tell if you're just making conversation in order to suck up to someone vs. are genuinely interested in talking to them. So if you genuinely do care about a person and show that through your interaction with them, they'd be likely to appreciate it more, and show that appreciation.

I'm curious, though: if you have nothing to say to a person, and don't say anything, do you get more or less of a tip than if you were to (insincerely) attempt to make polite conversation?

Re: Uber rolls out in-app tipping

#258

Post by kelnos »

tpeo wrote: post #196
throwaway055 wrote: post #162

Posting on a throwaway because of tipping stigma. I take close to 1,000 Uber trips per year. The biggest disappointment about this change to me is that I won't be having conversations with Uber drivers anymore. Uber drivers will now be obligated to make pleasant conversation with me. I have no interest in speaking to somebody who's obligated to make pleasant conversation with me. When you add tipping, you're essentia…

Never thought about the economics of tipping before, but if having the customers being able to punish unhelpful staff increases the odds of having returning customers, that would increase the likelihood of Uber drivers being better paid under competition. The only issue is whether Uber drivers have a comparable outside option. As for the bit on sincerity, can't say much as nowadays I just find it totally alien. Peopl…

> if having the customers being able to punish unhelpful staff increases the odds of having returning customers, that would increase the likelihood of Uber drivers being better paid under competition.

Doesn't the rating system approximate this outcome well enough, though? Being able to rate a driver, and see the overall rating before I get in the car is of huge value to me as a customer. Feeling obligated to tip is a net negative for me.

In a restaurant (in the US at least) it's so expected to tip that if you tip lower than 15% for terrible service you're considered cheapskate. Even though Uber's tipping will presumably be anonymous-ish (assuming they implement it like Lyft has), I would still feel that social pressure.

Re: Uber rolls out in-app tipping

#259

Post by wutbrodo »

adjkant wrote: post #224

I find it quite ironic that the majority of comments here seem to be against this addition and switching more people to Lyft who haven't already switched for moral reasons. By trying to become a better company and treat drivers better, they scared off the customers who didn't care about that. I'm sure this will get downvoted because I'm implying that people already should have switched for moral reasons, and a lot of…

> By trying to become a better company and treat drivers better

If you actually read the complaints here, the vast majority are against the manner of the pay increase, not the increase itself. If you're going to pretend that complaints against this are complaints against drivers' benefit, you need a reason that an across-the-board, no-Uber-commission pay rise wouldn't have done the same thing without making the product shittier.

Re: Uber rolls out in-app tipping

#260

Post by kelnos »

snowwrestler wrote: post #180
throwaway055 wrote: post #162

Posting on a throwaway because of tipping stigma. I take close to 1,000 Uber trips per year. The biggest disappointment about this change to me is that I won't be having conversations with Uber drivers anymore. Uber drivers will now be obligated to make pleasant conversation with me. I have no interest in speaking to somebody who's obligated to make pleasant conversation with me. When you add tipping, you're essentia…

How many Lyft trips per year for you? Because they've had tipping for a while, so you don't need to speculate about how this is going to ruin everything.

Not the person you're replying to, but I've been using Lyft exclusively for the past several months, and while I appreciate that Lyft's tipping is effectively anonymous and you're not put on the spot, I will admit to hating the cognitive/emotional load of seeing that tipping screen and momentarily agonizing over how much I should give.

It just happens to be that Lyft's tipping annoys me less than Uber's shitty corporate culture these days.

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