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Why are left-handers called “southpaws”? (2015)

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Re: Why are left-handers called “southpaws”? (2015)

#31

Post by nathan_f77 »

js2 wrote: post #25
nathan_f77 wrote: post #17

This post must be related to the recent "How do you draw a circle?" [1] article. They used the term "southpaw", which I had never heard before. EDIT: Strange, I definitely read the word "southpaw" somewhere in the last few days, and I remember learning that it was a term for left-handed people. Now I can't find it anywhere in the circle article, the HN comments [2], or the Reddit thread [3]. Little things like this r…

None of the above. :-) My daughter was doing geometry homework that had a question about the direction of a baseball field and claimed they are often oriented so that the batter faces east. I wanted to verify the assertion, and Google led me to this article. I was familiar with "southpaw" but always thought it was a boxing term and didn't know its etymology.

Haha, that's great. Just the Baader-Meinhof Phenomenon for me, then.

Re: Why are left-handers called “southpaws”? (2015)

#32

Post by mvf0 »

kazinator wrote: post #13

Possibly related: why does "going south" mean degrading, spoiling, breaking down ... The "paws" in "southpaws" clarifies that it is a derogatory term, suggesting that the left-handed are clumsy. Could it be that the sense of south in "going south" is a back formation from southpaw? Etymonline documents "going south" as meaning "vanish, abscond", tracing it to 1920's America: "American English, probably from mid-19c.…

Your analysis is incorrect.

'southpaw' is a boxing term that refers to left-handed boxers. It is in no way derogatory and did not originate with baseball [1]. In fact, it is more of a compliment because southpaws have a strategic and tactical advantage over right-handers due to stance.

'paw' as in hand

'south' as in 'not usual'

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southpaw_stance

Re: Why are left-handers called “southpaws”? (2015)

#33

Post by nickpeterson »

stevekemp wrote: post #26
kazinator wrote: post #13

Possibly related: why does "going south" mean degrading, spoiling, breaking down ... The "paws" in "southpaws" clarifies that it is a derogatory term, suggesting that the left-handed are clumsy. Could it be that the sense of south in "going south" is a back formation from southpaw? Etymonline documents "going south" as meaning "vanish, abscond", tracing it to 1920's America: "American English, probably from mid-19c.…

Remember that sinister is the Latin word for left-handed.. Historically, the left side, and subsequently left-handedness, was considered negative in many cultures. The Latin word sinistra originally meant "left" but took on meanings of "evil" or "unlucky" by the Classical Latin era, and this double meaning survives in European derivatives of Latin, and in the English word "sinister". Meanings gradually developed from…

Because most people are right handed, there is a notion of it being 'natural' to use their right hand. This is probably where we get the overlap with words that mean 'correct'. Doing something left-handed, for most people, is doing it backwards.

People are rarely left-handed, so there is an 'us verses them' notion behind the term. Right handed people are the default and left-handed people are different. Note phrases like "right hand man" describing someone you rely on.

Finally, a large percentage of leaders seem to be left handed (for reasons I cannot fathom), so perhaps sinister meaning evil has some root in people's criticism of those with power?

Re: Why are left-handers called “southpaws”? (2015)

#34

Post by galago »

Different parts of the UK had different names for left-handed people. It predates baseball or rounders. I can't remember which, but one region used the term 'southpaw'.

I've seen a map explaining this but I can't find it at the moment. Its a weird feeling when I completely can't find something via Google, even though I've seen it online.

Re: Why are left-handers called “southpaws”? (2015)

#35

Post by kls »

AdmiralAsshat wrote: post #30

Well, southpaw doesn't have a pejorative connotation, so I guess it beats being called "sinister".

sinistra, in Latin proper, simply meant left. It was later that someone decided that left = evil and sinister, well became sinister, but the historical root simply means left and is the original archaic definition of sinister.

Personally I am more concerned by our higher than average death rate than I am worried about being touched by the devil.

Re: Why are left-handers called “southpaws”? (2015)

#36

Post by inanutshellus »

kls wrote: post #35
AdmiralAsshat wrote: post #30

Well, southpaw doesn't have a pejorative connotation, so I guess it beats being called "sinister".

sinistra, in Latin proper, simply meant left. It was later that someone decided that left = evil and sinister, well became sinister, but the historical root simply means left and is the original archaic definition of sinister. Personally I am more concerned by our higher than average death rate than I am worried about being touched by the devil.

Don't let yourself be touched by the devil and maybe you'll live longer! /s

Re: Why are left-handers called “southpaws”? (2015)

#37

Post by kls »

nickpeterson wrote: post #33
stevekemp wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Remember that sinister is the Latin word for left-handed.. Historically, the left side, and subsequently left-handedness, was considered negative in many cultures. The Latin word sinistra originally meant "left" but took on meanings of "evil" or "unlucky" by the Classical Latin era, and this double meaning survives in European derivatives of Latin, and in the English word "sinister". Meanings gradually developed from…

Because most people are right handed, there is a notion of it being 'natural' to use their right hand. This is probably where we get the overlap with words that mean 'correct'. Doing something left-handed, for most people, is doing it backwards. People are rarely left-handed, so there is an 'us verses them' notion behind the term. Right handed people are the default and left-handed people are different. Note phrases…

Theory goes, left-handers have an advantage in battle (everyone has fought and trained against a right hander). Those that won, and had good political skills got to rule (and remain ruling) and reproduce, so it was self selecting for leadership. What is odd about that theory is our almost static percentage of the population thru the ages.

Re: Why are left-handers called “southpaws”? (2015)

#38

Post by B1FF_PSUVM »

lprubin wrote: post #15
hoorayimhelping wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where are you getting it's derogatory? It wasn't stated or implied in the article.

The phrase "Well, that went south really quickly" tends to mean a situation got really bad. Implying that south is bad.

What about going pear-shaped?

Re: Why are left-handers called “southpaws”? (2015)

#39

Post by pbhjpbhj »

AdmiralAsshat wrote: post #30

Well, southpaw doesn't have a pejorative connotation, so I guess it beats being called "sinister".

Seems just as likely that southpaw is a malapropism for sinister at some point; in our family at least mis-hearings are often a long way off the intended word.

Re: Why are left-handers called “southpaws”? (2015)

#40

Post by pbhjpbhj »

B1FF_PSUVM wrote: post #38
lprubin wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The phrase "Well, that went south really quickly" tends to mean a situation got really bad. Implying that south is bad.

What about going pear-shaped?

It's 'cause Pete Tong has a big arse. /s
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