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Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

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Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#181

Post by jandrese »

the_gastropod wrote: post #27
jandrese wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's an hour each way at a fairly decent clip on a bike[1]. In my book that's a long commute. [1] At roughly the speed I can bike in moderate to cool temps without getting excessively sweaty.

20km is ~6 miles each way. Unless there are significant obstacles (hills, many stoplights, etc), an hour to go 6 miles seems excessive.

I read it as 20km each way, 40km total. I agree that a 10km each way trip is far more reasonable. In fact that's only slightly longer than my 5 mile bike commute, and I bet they have fewer 90F (32c) and 80% humidity days than we do here.

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#182

Post by s73ver »

InitialLastName wrote: post #99
ashark wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Just look at any suburbs: the inhabitants clearly disagree with me. Some of us just have kids and have noticed that all the city housing is either incredibly expensive or in slums, and the schools in the city proper are dangerous and terrible so we'd also have to pay for private school[0]. And we're not made of money. I'd much rather live in the city—I hate the car-centric lifestyle—but living there if I have enoug…

That's a chicken-and-egg problem too... inner-city schools suck because everyone with money took their taxes to the suburbs (for better schools).

"inner-city schools suck because everyone with money took their taxes to the suburbs (for better schools)."

Let's not beat around the bush; this happened back in the day because they took their taxes to the suburbs for mostly white schools.

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#183

Post by collyw »

jacquesm wrote: post #162
nisse72 wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would imagine that an angle grinder works equally well with all locks regardless of brand.

Cold spray and a hammer is faster and much less noisy and does not come with a free pyrotechnics display.

Does that work? And what do you mean by cold spray exactly? Ralgex?

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#184

Post by djhworld »

The Netherlands had the opportunity to hit the reset switch in the 1970s with public support, that pushed through the changes in infrastructure and culture to foster a cycling centric society.

I'm wondering if that could ever happen today, I think the motoring/oil and road lobbyists are so well entrenched and organised in governments across the world, I highly doubt it.

I live in London and would never dream of cycling here, I'd be too nervous to do it.

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#185

Post by InitialLastName »

Mz wrote: post #155
InitialLastName wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a chicken-and-egg problem too... inner-city schools suck because everyone with money took their taxes to the suburbs (for better schools).

Money spent on education correlates very poorly with educational quality at k-12 level. (This may be different a the college level.) Parental involvement and other factors are much stronger indicators.

As a sibling of yours pointed out, the presence of affluent peers makes a big difference.

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#186

Post by Freak_NL »

svl wrote: post #82
giobox wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think for most cities, locks and lights are unavoidable costs, if you want to stay safe and still have your bike be where you left it... Some would argue a helmet should be too, but experienced cyclists know better than to open that debate up! Unless you live somewhere with a great climate, foul weather clothing inevitably ends up needing bought if you intend to commute all year round by bike.

No one uses helmets. Most people don't use panniers either; small loads are attached to the back of the bike by the default "snelbinders" (elastic straps). Or what's really popular lately are plastic crates above the front-wheel. Locks and lights (and reflective strips on the wheels) are standard on all bikes. In cities you'd get a second lock, but that's really about it.

As for the foul weather clothing; you would need a raincoat anyhow and a pair of rain pants won't set you back that much.

I spend about €15 a month on my bicycle if I spread out the cost of purchase, clothing, and maintenance (mostly parts, I do my own maintenance, which isn't uncommon here). That's for a high quality, extra tall bicycle (I'm 2m tall) that looks presentable enough for my daily commute to work.

A student could probably manage with €3 to €8 a month.

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#187

Post by revelation »

jdietrich wrote: post #128
raidoxim wrote: post #92

I'm Dutch, but think we tend to underestimate the impact of the flatness of our country, and the size of other countries especially the States. I've cycled on my normal 7-gear bicycle (and that might be considered fancy) from Newcastle to Carlisle. Which is quite flat. I had to walk so much up hill as it was utterly impossible to climb 40 meters. In the Netherlands quite a lot of people do live in a 50 km radius of t…

The three-speed hub gears that are typical in the Netherlands are practically unknown over here in the UK. Even the cheapest bicycles will have a 27-speed triple setup with an extremely low bottom gear. Mountain bikes completely took over the market in the 1990s, with a lasting legacy for almost all styles of bicycle. A couple of cities are extremely challenging for cyclists (most notably Bristol) and we do have a fe…

That's not because the UK are so extremely hilly and adverse mountainous terrain (it's not) but because in car centric countries, shitty bike shaped objects sold in shops like WalMart dominate the market and what sells best to that audience that doesn't really actually use a bicycle? Cool looking mountain bikes with useless shocks and all the bells and whistles.

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#188

Post by Mz »

InitialLastName wrote: post #185
Mz wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Money spent on education correlates very poorly with educational quality at k-12 level. (This may be different a the college level.) Parental involvement and other factors are much stronger indicators.

As a sibling of yours pointed out, the presence of affluent peers makes a big difference.

Look, I know you don't know me as some kind of education expert, but I homeschooled my gifted-learning disabled sons for a lot of years and I was Director of Community Life at TAGFAM for a brief period and I know whereof I speak here. Those peers are almost certainly not just affluent, they are almost certainly also well read, well spoken and well educated.

Money easily grows out of being well educated, assuming there aren't other barriers to accomplishment. You have the cause and effect relationship here backwards.

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#189

Post by gech »

djhworld wrote: post #184

The Netherlands had the opportunity to hit the reset switch in the 1970s with public support, that pushed through the changes in infrastructure and culture to foster a cycling centric society. I'm wondering if that could ever happen today, I think the motoring/oil and road lobbyists are so well entrenched and organised in governments across the world, I highly doubt it. I live in London and would never dream of cycli…

I like other HNers only thought things were possible through the providence of the free-market though?

Re: Why is cycling so popular in the Netherlands?

#190

Post by bamboozled »

rollingpebbles wrote: post #123
dtech wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a fellow dutchman, duct-tape the shit out of everything on your new bike. If you're really brave even partially paint it in a hideous color (purple or something). You'll still have a bad looking bike, but at least it will be mechanically much nicer than your fifth-hand rusting omafiets. Since I started doing that I never had a bike stolen in 15 years, despite living in Rotterdam and Utrecht (big cities) and buying…

There should be vinyl wrap for bikes that provides a paintable, duct-tapeable substrain for camo tape and radioactive fuchsia and orange also camo ejaculation. Flat (no shine) paint makes a bike even less attractive. PS: I had a old/ugly bike that I had for 16 years in Davis, CA that I still locked and it was stolen from an apt complex the one and only time I forgot to lock it. There are thieves whom ride around in c…

The idea for Amsterdam is to make the bike look unique, not always unnatractive, the more homogenous looking and mechanically sound, the more attractive to thieves.

Amsterdam is a smalll place so having a fluro green bike with a number plate of your name welded to the frame is a good deterrent.

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