Polynesian people used a kind of binary number system 600 years ago (2013) • Hacker News Board

Re: Polynesian people used a kind of binary number system 600 years ago (2013)

#121

Post by indolering » Sat, Jun 17, 2017, 7:26 AM UTC

siosonel wrote: post #101

indolering wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Some people like me thinks this is a newsworthy discovery. Because you don't understand math. Binary arithmetic is a painfully obvious development. A bored high-schooler predisposed to mathematics would figure it out in an afternoon. And we've documented cultures using mixed base systems in the past. All this would have taken is a single person to say, "Hey, some things are easier if you do it this way" and taught…

How do you know I don't understand math? And if a high schooler could figure this out, then Leibnitz own discussion or contribution to this topic is then meaningless? The main point is that the finding in the article has cultural significance, rather than purely in terms of mathematics. I think you either don't understand that or are not willing to see that. The article is not trying to elevate a Polynesian people's…

> How do you know I don't understand math?

Because if you had a deep appreciation for mathematical structures you wouldn't be surprised by this development.

> And if a high schooler could figure this out, then Leibnitz own discussion or contribution to this topic is then meaningless?

Mostly, yes. Binary is useful for computers, but it's not like we use binary algebra in our daily lives. FWIW, Leibnitz did a much better job at calculus than Newton ... mathematical construct that has been "discovered" at least 3 times.

> The main point is that the finding in the article has cultural significance, rather than purely in terms of mathematics. I think you either don't understand that or are not willing to see that.

The OP was complaining about Nature screwing up the understanding of the mathematics and chiding the social scientists for ignorant remarks about the mathematics involved. I am also tired of seeing silly pop-science articles being posted HN.

> Could there an underlying commonality in the way humans learn and organize knowledge?

Yes, it does and this finding does not contribute to what we already know about mathematics and its relation to cognition [0]. I'm frankly a bit embarrassed by my social science colleagues and Nature for not doing a better job framing their findings more appropriately.

Sorry for being curt.

0:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Where_Mathematics_Comes_From

Re: Polynesian people used a kind of binary number system 600 years ago (2013)

#122

Post by siosonel » Sat, Jun 17, 2017, 2:44 PM UTC

indolering wrote: post #121

siosonel wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you know I don't understand math? And if a high schooler could figure this out, then Leibnitz own discussion or contribution to this topic is then meaningless? The main point is that the finding in the article has cultural significance, rather than purely in terms of mathematics. I think you either don't understand that or are not willing to see that. The article is not trying to elevate a Polynesian people's…

> How do you know I don't understand math? Because if you had a deep appreciation for mathematical structures you wouldn't be surprised by this development. > And if a high schooler could figure this out, then Leibnitz own discussion or contribution to this topic is then meaningless? Mostly, yes. Binary is useful for computers, but it's not like we use binary algebra in our daily lives. FWIW, Leibnitz did a much bett…

I am not surprised by the mathematical development described in the article. Rather, I appreciate that there is yet new evidence for what I believe about human capacity and potential across cultures. I felt a small level vindication and inspiration, not surprise.

I'm not sure why you insist on finding fault with what I understand or not, or what you wrongly imagine my reaction is to this article. It's possible to appreciate stories like that without being shallow or sensationalist. At the same time, it is possible to be unnecessarily dismissive about something when the focus is solely on technical aspects and lose the bigger picture of what a story is about.

I think we agree that truly unique discoveries or inventions are extremely rare. I did not get the sense that the article framed the islander's number system as such. It's okay to disagree if you see the framing differently.

Re: Polynesian people used a kind of binary number system 600 years ago (2013)

#123

Post by rlander » Sun, Jun 18, 2017, 7:17 PM UTC

doublec wrote: post #40

rlander wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did your trip include Pitcairn Island? I'd be interested in your impressions of the place (population 50, boat every 3 months or so).

Yes it did. I visited in 2012. I put some photos online here http://cd.pn/pn2012/ That covers the trip from Mangareva to Pitcairn and back. I loved it on Pitcairn. The island is small but very hilly so there's more walking around and things to see than I expected. The people were friendly and welcoming. I went there via a yacht from Mangareva that was chartered through an island run travel agency. I stayed for about…

Thanks for sharing! Hopefully one day I'll be visiting Pitcairn myself. Btw, I infer from your comment that you descend from one of the Bounty crew members, am I correct in assuming that? If so, that trip must have been awesome since so many connections to your ancestry are still preserved there.

Re: Polynesian people used a kind of binary number system 600 years ago (2013)

#124

Post by indolering » Wed, Jun 21, 2017, 1:57 AM UTC

siosonel wrote: post #122

indolering wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How do you know I don't understand math? Because if you had a deep appreciation for mathematical structures you wouldn't be surprised by this development. > And if a high schooler could figure this out, then Leibnitz own discussion or contribution to this topic is then meaningless? Mostly, yes. Binary is useful for computers, but it's not like we use binary algebra in our daily lives. FWIW, Leibnitz did a much bett…

I am not surprised by the mathematical development described in the article. Rather, I appreciate that there is yet new evidence for what I believe about human capacity and potential across cultures. I felt a small level vindication and inspiration, not surprise. I'm not sure why you insist on finding fault with what I understand or not, or what you wrongly imagine my reaction is to this article. It's possible to app…

> I'm not sure why you insist on finding fault with what I understand or not

Again, I am just trying to validate the OP's points about social scientists screwing up basic mathematics on Nature's website.

> At the same time, it is possible to be unnecessarily dismissive about something when the focus is solely on technical aspects and lose the bigger picture of what a story is about.

Agreed! I spend all my time on this stuff and it's the coolest thing ever ... and I'm really sad that Nature doesn't come right out and say what you are saying.

Again, sorry for being curt. I didn't mean to insult you, we really don't have time to understand everything.

Re: Polynesian people used a kind of binary number system 600 years ago (2013)

#125

Post by acjohnson55 » Wed, Jun 21, 2017, 2:56 AM UTC

netcan wrote: post #88

The Polynesian history of the (european) middle ages keeps getting more interesting and mysterious. Evidence for polynesian contact with the Americas is mounting. Regardless, the medieval coonization of all the pacific islands is evidence of seamanship and navigation skills European mariners didn't achieve until well into the age of sail. European sailing was much more trade/cargo oriented & we know a lot less about…

Polynesian history blows my mind. I was reading about it a few months ago, which introduced me to the concept of thalassocracy.

It blows my mind how sophisticated their navigational skills were, and how they transmitted the information without writing.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thalassocracy