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Chicago taxi industry sliding towards collapse

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Re: Chicago taxi industry sliding towards collapse

#251

Post by pavel_lishin »

monksy wrote: post #119
shostack wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I lived in Chicago for most of my life until somewhat recently. Things I observed during that time: - A driver stating, seemingly out of nowhere to my friend and I, "we should just take all of the gays out back and shoot them" - Multiple times scheduling a morning pickup for a flight, not having it arrive, and being told by the uncaring operator the alternative was to wait so long I'd miss my flight, or gamble with t…

> - A cab driver who picked me up at my home to go to the airport who then kicked me out part way there because I was on the phone with my mother and he refused to turn down his radio when I requested (which is in the friggin 'Passenger's Bill of Rights' posted in the back of the cab). He then loudly threatened me with physical violence once I exited the vehicle. I ended up asking the cab company to not fire him once…

Are you wondering whether the cabbie would have been more polite, knowing that his passenger might be armed?

Or are you wondering whether shostack might have been shot himself?

Re: Chicago taxi industry sliding towards collapse

#252

Post by FullMtlAlcoholc »

valuearb wrote: post #249
FullMtlAlcoholc wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your bias is causing you to come to some faulty conclusions. I did not quote the number of medallions given out by the city (which by the way is around 7000 [0]). I specifically stated the number of people employed as taxi drivers, which as of Dec 2016, is 9500. [1] > Most drivers can switch to Uber/Lyft if they have or want to buy their own cars, or get other jobs. Although some of them can probably use their primar…

No jobs have been destroyed. Chicago needs roughly the same number of drivers, just more are going to be driving Lyft or Uber in the future than Taxis. Taxi drivers might even do better with Lyft and Uber given they weren't getting any of the monopoly profits for driving. Subprime is less than 20% of car loans, because it's easy to get a car loan if you have good (decent, not great) credit. Car loans are relatively s…

But the market is already saturated with the top Uber/Lyft drivers who have maintained a rating above 4.0 stars. Do you thhink the growth in ride-hailing will be able to absorb so many people such that drivers are able to maintain the same number of fares/day? I don't have any data on this.

Re: Chicago taxi industry sliding towards collapse

#253

Post by pravda »

ThrustVectoring wrote: post #11
greglindahl wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google [bank taxi medallion exposure] and you'll discover a few banks that are going to go under. Not a significant problem in the big picture, but it is still a problem for more than just medallion owners.

Good riddance. Taxi medallions are a market in rent-seeking, investing in it should mean you lose your shirt.

I do feel a little bit of schadenfreude at the predicament of NYCs biggest medallion speculator:

http://pix11.com/2017/06/07/nyc-taxi-king-accused-of-failing...

Now some medallion owners are trying to get gov't money to bail them out:

https://www.scribd.com/document/346690906/Letter-to-Governor...

Re: Chicago taxi industry sliding towards collapse

#254

Post by weberc2 »

xigency wrote: post #207
weberc2 wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What people don't realize is that once the taxi companies are dead, the ride sharing apps will be able to raise prices and lower quality. The rideshare companies are still in competition with each other. The market will stabilize at a price necessarily lower than taxi price, which was artificially inflated by local governments. This doesn't seem like a valid concern. > whether at a corporate level Sounds like you'r…

At some point the VC money will run out, so yes the subsidies will collapse. And Uber is the McDonald's or Wal-Mart of ride sharing. When you see employees complain about Wal-Mart being fundamentally unethical, you will see not a damn thing change. That's one reason to care. Not necessarily a problem fundamental to ride sharing, but the ride sharing ecosystem may be toxic, and I don't see where repercussions would be…

1. When the VC money runs out, timeshare will still beat taxis on price until something changes with the regulatory landscape, because a good chunk of each ride goes into meeting bad government regulations. 2. Its not meant to be an even playing field; that timeshare can outcompeted Taxis without any adverse social effect demonstrates the inefficiencies imposed on the industry by way of useless regulation.

3. I don't doubt there are bad rideshare stories. This doesn't mean ride share is somehow less safe than taxis, hence fear mongering.

5. Drivers seem to love ride share as far as I can tell, so the McDonalds/Walmart comparisons aren't apt, even if I was certain that Walmart and McDonalds are unethical companies.

Re: Chicago taxi industry sliding towards collapse

#255

Post by weberc2 »

clock_tower wrote: post #146
weberc2 wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The original comment referred to price gouging due to lack of competition. VC money might subsidize the rides (or more likely find ongoing development?), but Uber and Lyft are bound to be cheaper than taxis for as long as they can remain less entangled with governments (less artificial price inflation).

The problem is that Uber loses money on every ride, so they'll have to raise their rates as soon as they stop being subsidized by VCs -- unless they have self-driving taxis by then.

Or they stop investing so heavily in platform development. Without detailed knowledge of their accounts it's hard to predict what might happen when capital shrinks.

Re: Chicago taxi industry sliding towards collapse

#256

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Re: Chicago taxi industry sliding towards collapse

#257

Post by xigency »

weberc2 wrote: post #254
xigency wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At some point the VC money will run out, so yes the subsidies will collapse. And Uber is the McDonald's or Wal-Mart of ride sharing. When you see employees complain about Wal-Mart being fundamentally unethical, you will see not a damn thing change. That's one reason to care. Not necessarily a problem fundamental to ride sharing, but the ride sharing ecosystem may be toxic, and I don't see where repercussions would be…

1. When the VC money runs out, timeshare will still beat taxis on price until something changes with the regulatory landscape, because a good chunk of each ride goes into meeting bad government regulations. 2. Its not meant to be an even playing field; that timeshare can outcompeted Taxis without any adverse social effect demonstrates the inefficiencies imposed on the industry by way of useless regulation. 3. I don't…

Oh, people love Wal-Mart and McDonalds too, but they have huge negative externalities that are bad for their workers and the global food supply.

Re: Chicago taxi industry sliding towards collapse

#258

Post by jhou2 »

tw04 wrote: post #96
bitJericho wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

VCs wont pay for rides forever.

VCs are just paying for rides until self-driving cars get to the point that drivers are no longer needed. I'm not concerned with the price of rides increasing, I'm concerned with the unemployment our country is going to get punched in the face with. Between cab drivers and OTR (truckers), we're going to have a MUCH bigger problem on our hands than we've seen since Detroit collapsed (which was arguably less of an issu…

With Uber, Lyft, and other ride-sharing services, I would say there is more employed in the "move people from A to B" business now than ever before. The mobile apps increased the supply of drivers and captured the market demand for convenient and cheaper rides.

Self-driving would take away a big chunk of that market, but estimates vary on when that becomes a reality. With every major technology improvement, there were massive employment and social shifts. Wars and revolutions were often side effects. However, I don't think the percentage of the population engaged in the taxicab and trucking industries are enough to destabilize society. By its nature, the employees in that business are often transitory. Perhaps there will be legislation to force self-driving vehicles such as taxicabs and commercial trucks to keep a human "driver" to supervise and assist when the vehicle gets into situations outside of its programming.

Re: Chicago taxi industry sliding towards collapse

#259

Post by agotterer »

pavel_lishin wrote: post #244
spydum wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's worse than just pricing.. I've had several taxis "pretend" their meter stopped working, to try to scam a cash ride.

Is that a problem for you, assuming that the price of the ride didn't change? I don't particularly want to enable crime, but if a driver wants to rip off the owner of the medallion bolted to the car he's driving, that's not particularly my problem, any more so than the Taco Bell employee slipping my cash into his pocket instead of the till.

It is a problem if you the passenger don't know if you are being ripped off and are paying a reasonable fare.

Re: Chicago taxi industry sliding towards collapse

#260

Post by [deleted] »

pavel_lishin wrote: post #244
spydum wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's worse than just pricing.. I've had several taxis "pretend" their meter stopped working, to try to scam a cash ride.

Is that a problem for you, assuming that the price of the ride didn't change? I don't particularly want to enable crime, but if a driver wants to rip off the owner of the medallion bolted to the car he's driving, that's not particularly my problem, any more so than the Taco Bell employee slipping my cash into his pocket instead of the till.

[deleted]
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