Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

India, Once a Coal Goliath, Is Fast Turning Green

nytimes.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

11–20 of 160 posts

Re: India, Once a Coal Goliath, Is Fast Turning Green

#11

Post by topspin »

hueving wrote: post #7

India, "still a coal Goliath" is a better description. They burn a massive amount of coal compared to most countries. They've just scaled slightly back on a massive coal consumption plan they implemented in the last few years. Nice, but hardly worth any recognition in the shadow of the damage they have already done.

Indeed. India has a coal glut on their hands. India was opening one new coal planet every month at the end of 2015. Around the same time India's Arvin Subramanian coined the term “carbon imperialism" during Paris accord negotiations because India didn't like the terms.

As expected, much more favorable terms were renegotiated to get India on board; India now gets to grow their CO2 emission as a function of GDP. A simple extrapolation of this shows they'll double their already huge CO2 output by the end of the decade, far surpassing the US.

Made the deal a lot easier to sign.

Re: India, Once a Coal Goliath, Is Fast Turning Green

#13

Post by throwawayjava »

topspin wrote: post #11
hueving wrote: post #7

India, "still a coal Goliath" is a better description. They burn a massive amount of coal compared to most countries. They've just scaled slightly back on a massive coal consumption plan they implemented in the last few years. Nice, but hardly worth any recognition in the shadow of the damage they have already done.

Indeed. India has a coal glut on their hands. India was opening one new coal planet every month at the end of 2015. Around the same time India's Arvin Subramanian coined the term “carbon imperialism" during Paris accord negotiations because India didn't like the terms. As expected, much more favorable terms were renegotiated to get India on board; India now gets to grow their CO2 emission as a function of GDP. A simp…

> far surpassing the US

Why is this a problem? India has 4x the population...

Re: India, Once a Coal Goliath, Is Fast Turning Green

#14

Post by specializeded »

yumraj wrote: post #10
hueving wrote: post #7

India, "still a coal Goliath" is a better description. They burn a massive amount of coal compared to most countries. They've just scaled slightly back on a massive coal consumption plan they implemented in the last few years. Nice, but hardly worth any recognition in the shadow of the damage they have already done.

> in the shadow of the damage they have already done. Really? See here: http://www.tsp-data-portal.org/Breakdown-of-Electricity-Gene... U.S. generated, per 2014 data, 1612 TWh from Coal and 1272 TWh from Gas. China generated 3681 TWh from Coal and 91 TWh from Gas. Compare this to India, which generated a mere 800 TWh from Coal and 89 TWh from Gas. And this when India has more than 4 times the population of US and acc…

The article is comparing India to India, the commenter is comparing India to India, you're not.

A country having less output compared to more developed countries isn't surprising, nor the issue.

Re: India, Once a Coal Goliath, Is Fast Turning Green

#15

Post by xparadigm »

Yeah unless India influences corrupt politicians of neighboring countries to make coal based power plants in neighbouring countries and imports electricity from those plants. Search "Rampal Power Plant", "greatest mangrove forest of the planet" etc. Also please see: https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/energy-environment/wp/20...

Re: India, Once a Coal Goliath, Is Fast Turning Green

#16

Post by jacquesm »

kornish wrote: post #4
L_Rahman wrote: post #3

Parts of the theory of disruption - specifically that an entity with less entrenched structures, can solve problems in more efficient ways - applies to nation states as well. When 25% of your country has no electricity at all, you get to imagine parts of your grid from the ground up. If there's an expectation of load-shedding and your grid doesn't have to be at a 100% in all places, you have room to make mistakes. Mo…

> In many ways it's similar to how telephony spread in the developing world. They skipped landlines entirely and went straight to GSM. And also how banking/payment is spreading in Africa: mobile-to-mobile, skipping credit cards entirely.

The same happened in Spain, first time I saw someone doing a payment by mobile was at a bus-stop, as if it was normal he paid his electricity bill. It was the result of a collaboration between Telefonica and one or more banks, I forgot what it was called.

Way ahead of the rest of Europe, this probably was early 2000 or 2001.

Re: India, Once a Coal Goliath, Is Fast Turning Green

#17

Post by [deleted] »

throwawayjava wrote: post #13
topspin wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed. India has a coal glut on their hands. India was opening one new coal planet every month at the end of 2015. Around the same time India's Arvin Subramanian coined the term “carbon imperialism" during Paris accord negotiations because India didn't like the terms. As expected, much more favorable terms were renegotiated to get India on board; India now gets to grow their CO2 emission as a function of GDP. A simp…

> far surpassing the US Why is this a problem? India has 4x the population...

[deleted]

Re: India, Once a Coal Goliath, Is Fast Turning Green

#18

Post by rajathagasthya »

specializeded wrote: post #14
yumraj wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> in the shadow of the damage they have already done. Really? See here: http://www.tsp-data-portal.org/Breakdown-of-Electricity-Gene... U.S. generated, per 2014 data, 1612 TWh from Coal and 1272 TWh from Gas. China generated 3681 TWh from Coal and 91 TWh from Gas. Compare this to India, which generated a mere 800 TWh from Coal and 89 TWh from Gas. And this when India has more than 4 times the population of US and acc…

The article is comparing India to India, the commenter is comparing India to India, you're not. A country having less output compared to more developed countries isn't surprising, nor the issue.

> They burn a massive amount of coal compared to most countries.

What part of this is comparing India to India?

Re: India, Once a Coal Goliath, Is Fast Turning Green

#19

Post by scythe »

jacquesm wrote: post #16
kornish wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In many ways it's similar to how telephony spread in the developing world. They skipped landlines entirely and went straight to GSM. And also how banking/payment is spreading in Africa: mobile-to-mobile, skipping credit cards entirely.

The same happened in Spain, first time I saw someone doing a payment by mobile was at a bus-stop, as if it was normal he paid his electricity bill. It was the result of a collaboration between Telefonica and one or more banks, I forgot what it was called. Way ahead of the rest of Europe, this probably was early 2000 or 2001.

"Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the Earth"

Re: India, Once a Coal Goliath, Is Fast Turning Green

#20

Post by danbolt »

kornish wrote: post #4
L_Rahman wrote: post #3

Parts of the theory of disruption - specifically that an entity with less entrenched structures, can solve problems in more efficient ways - applies to nation states as well. When 25% of your country has no electricity at all, you get to imagine parts of your grid from the ground up. If there's an expectation of load-shedding and your grid doesn't have to be at a 100% in all places, you have room to make mistakes. Mo…

> In many ways it's similar to how telephony spread in the developing world. They skipped landlines entirely and went straight to GSM. And also how banking/payment is spreading in Africa: mobile-to-mobile, skipping credit cards entirely.

I love the elegance and futurism of paying with mobile phones like that, but do the telephone companies operate in a similar manner to financial institutions there?

For instance, if I deposit money, do I receive interest? What happens to my funds if the phone company goes bankrupt? Are there similar regulations to banks?

Post reply on HN