WA, NY and CA Governors Announce Formation of United States Climate Alliance • Hacker News Board

Re: WA, NY and CA Governors Announce Formation of United States Climate Alliance

#111

Post by xienze » Thu, Jun 01, 2017, 11:39 PM UTC

spamizbad wrote: post #97

mudil wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

S&P, Moody's Downgrade Illinois to Near Junk, Lowest Ever for U.S. State https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-06-01/illinois-...

At the state-level, Illinois has the fewest government employees per 1000 citizens. Source: http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/sdut-ap-data-states-shed... Our medicaid costs are below the national average. Per-capita education costs are also some of the lowest (at the state level - IL depends heavily on local property taxes) Our Republican governor has been unable to cut any state-level waste for that very reason: T…

> We're in a budget mess because of pension obligations

Let me guess, that's also the fault of the Republicans.

Re: WA, NY and CA Governors Announce Formation of United States Climate Alliance

#112

Post by jjawssd » Thu, Jun 01, 2017, 11:39 PM UTC

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #13

vyrotek wrote: post #6

Maybe we can get Phoenix in on this too? http://www.azfamily.com/story/35561955/phoenix-mayor-vows-to...

Global warming might be a bad deal for Arizona. But most big city governments are going to be run by liberal Democrats because...they are big cities. Not that they are wrong, just pointing that out.

The fact that many larger cities are controlled by Democrats is a very interesting phenomenon that I do not fully understand.

Re: WA, NY and CA Governors Announce Formation of United States Climate Alliance

#113

Post by njarboe » Thu, Jun 01, 2017, 11:40 PM UTC

michaelchisari wrote: post #61

Karrot_Kream wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I'm happy that the states are picking up the slack, are you really insinuating that the Red states are leading to their own self-destruction, going on to "languish"? I'm saddened that people have this viewpoint over such a large swath of the country.

Except that there is overwhelming truth to it. There are now, effectively, two economic models for states to follow, and they're very partisan models. There is the California model (high taxes, high minimum wage, strong environmental standards, strong labor protections, etc) and the Kansas model (cut taxes, privatization, gutting protections). California's growth rate compared to Kansas' growth rate is a matter of ni…

You might have cause and effect backwards (hard to know when you can't do experiments) but having a strong economy and wealth due to say Silicon Valley, Hollywood, or Wall Street (however those were created and sustained) might allow people to choose to have "(high taxes, high minimum wage, strong environmental standards, strong labor protections, etc)".

Re: WA, NY and CA Governors Announce Formation of United States Climate Alliance

#114

Post by jjawssd » Thu, Jun 01, 2017, 11:40 PM UTC

scarmig wrote: post #34

Throw in all the solidly blue states and all the solidly blue cities, and you'd have a majority of the US's population and GDP.

Why do these non-democrats hold the USA hostage to their policies? Why can't the democrats appeal to them?

Re: WA, NY and CA Governors Announce Formation of United States Climate Alliance

#115

Post by xienze » Thu, Jun 01, 2017, 11:41 PM UTC

toisanji wrote: post #90

I would read the full speech from Trump, he makes some good points, although im sure some of it is false and not sure how it compares to other factors. http://www.cnn.com/2017/06/01/politics/trump-paris-agreement... "For example, under the agreement, China will be able to increase these emissions by a staggering number of years -- 13. They can do whatever they want for 13 years. Not us. India makes its participation…

Yeah that's my biggest beef with the Paris Agreement. If it's about the global environment, why are all countries not compelled to participate equally? Don't let China off the hook and I think a lot of people would be less skeptical of the whole arrangement.

Re: WA, NY and CA Governors Announce Formation of United States Climate Alliance

#116

Post by aaron-lebo » Thu, Jun 01, 2017, 11:41 PM UTC

stevenwoo wrote: post #79

abalashov wrote: post #2

If they could just somehow recruit Texas to the cause, they'd pretty much have the leverage, as anchors of economics and policy for much of the rest of the country.

The primary issue in the Texas legislature the last session was who could go to the bathroom. They couldn't figure it out so now they are going to have a special session to iron out the details. So Texas is not going to lead the country anywhere. http://www.texasmonthly.com/burka-blog/order-timeline-bathro...

In 2008, Californians voted through referendum to make gay marriage illegal, overruling their own supreme court.

If that incident had no great impact on Cali's overall ability to lead, why does this event say anything about TX's?

Re: WA, NY and CA Governors Announce Formation of United States Climate Alliance

#117

Post by babyrainbow » Thu, Jun 01, 2017, 11:41 PM UTC

toisanji wrote: post #90

I would read the full speech from Trump, he makes some good points, although im sure some of it is false and not sure how it compares to other factors. http://www.cnn.com/2017/06/01/politics/trump-paris-agreement... "For example, under the agreement, China will be able to increase these emissions by a staggering number of years -- 13. They can do whatever they want for 13 years. Not us. India makes its participation…

Really wish this was at the top, instead of a comment that simply calls the president "shit-the-bed" Trump.

It is scary how people, even on HN, go on a hating spree with out actually looking into these details. If you go on reddit, you see the same thing, but multiplied 10x.

It is a sickening display of how even "smart" communities, like HIN can harbour stupid behaviors and beliefs as long as the majority shares it....

Re: WA, NY and CA Governors Announce Formation of United States Climate Alliance

#118

Post by moduspol » Thu, Jun 01, 2017, 11:41 PM UTC

toisanji wrote: post #90

I would read the full speech from Trump, he makes some good points, although im sure some of it is false and not sure how it compares to other factors. http://www.cnn.com/2017/06/01/politics/trump-paris-agreement... "For example, under the agreement, China will be able to increase these emissions by a staggering number of years -- 13. They can do whatever they want for 13 years. Not us. India makes its participation…

Like most climate policy, it becomes a lot less appealing the more specific it gets.

Re: WA, NY and CA Governors Announce Formation of United States Climate Alliance

#119

Post by yks » Thu, Jun 01, 2017, 11:41 PM UTC

xienze wrote: post #107

One thing I never see addressed with all the talk about climate change: Let's say we managed to cease our CO2 production, even reverse the current man-made warming trend (save me the "impossible hypothetical scenario" talk, substitute in whatever values of "cease" we would have accomplished with the Paris Agreement, whatever). Eventually, the earth is going to warm significantly without the aid of mankind. What are w…

Postpone immediate danger until we're sufficiently technologically advanced to deal with other issues? Or, in other words, build MVP first instead of starting the heavy project which ultimately cannot be finished by the deadline.

Re: WA, NY and CA Governors Announce Formation of United States Climate Alliance

#120

Post by jorblumesea » Thu, Jun 01, 2017, 11:41 PM UTC

vmarsy wrote: post #69

michaelchisari wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except that there is overwhelming truth to it. There are now, effectively, two economic models for states to follow, and they're very partisan models. There is the California model (high taxes, high minimum wage, strong environmental standards, strong labor protections, etc) and the Kansas model (cut taxes, privatization, gutting protections). California's growth rate compared to Kansas' growth rate is a matter of ni…

WA state has strong protections and environmental standards, but I wouldn't consider it high tax (no income tax for instance). Is it an outlier?

We have higher sales tax than most, which is regressive and disproportionately impacts lower incomes. Property taxes in certain areas (Seattle) can be higher as well.

But the lack of income tax and higher wages make up for it. My tax burden is about 30% of my income, whereas in other states, Red and Blue alike, it would be anywhere from 30-40%. In general it's a low tax state, which is great for high income earners but not great for the state budget. We've had constant battles over funding education and Washington schools are woefully underfunded.