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Ask HN: Typical Startup or Abuse?

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Re: Ask HN: Typical Startup or Abuse?

#81

Post by lkrubner »

lkrubner wrote: post #79

I am confused by this: "and I am still making around $500/week. Which, in the beginning was great. However over the past year I have moved out, bought a car (out of need, the other died), gotten married, and have had a child. (With a second one on the way.)" Why would you have 2 children if you are making $500 a week? Does your spouse make a lot of money? Do you live in one of the developed countries, or a 3rd world…

Oh, I see this:

"He still gives all of us a 1099."

The 1099 is a form given out by the IRS in the USA. So you are in the USA. What the hell? Why would you have 2 kids on $500 a week in the USA?

Re: Ask HN: Typical Startup or Abuse?

#82

Post by lkrubner »

lkrubner wrote: post #81
lkrubner wrote: post #79

I am confused by this: "and I am still making around $500/week. Which, in the beginning was great. However over the past year I have moved out, bought a car (out of need, the other died), gotten married, and have had a child. (With a second one on the way.)" Why would you have 2 children if you are making $500 a week? Does your spouse make a lot of money? Do you live in one of the developed countries, or a 3rd world…

Oh, I see this: "He still gives all of us a 1099." The 1099 is a form given out by the IRS in the USA. So you are in the USA. What the hell? Why would you have 2 kids on $500 a week in the USA?

You also write:

"Yet, he treats us like employees. We have required working times, usually 8AM - 6PM, we only get a half hour lunch with no other breaks, and are on-call 24-7. Honestly, those items don't even bother me that much. "

On the bright side, it is illegal for him to treat independent contractors like this, so you can sue him if you want. The IRS has been cracking down on exactly this form of abuse lately.

Re: Ask HN: Typical Startup or Abuse?

#83

Post by alexwyser »

lkrubner wrote: post #81
lkrubner wrote: post #79

I am confused by this: "and I am still making around $500/week. Which, in the beginning was great. However over the past year I have moved out, bought a car (out of need, the other died), gotten married, and have had a child. (With a second one on the way.)" Why would you have 2 children if you are making $500 a week? Does your spouse make a lot of money? Do you live in one of the developed countries, or a 3rd world…

Oh, I see this: "He still gives all of us a 1099." The 1099 is a form given out by the IRS in the USA. So you are in the USA. What the hell? Why would you have 2 kids on $500 a week in the USA?

He is located in Pennsylvania, and he's only 21 so its a bit odd that he's married with 2 kids...

Re: Ask HN: Typical Startup or Abuse?

#84

Post by techiferous »

patio11 wrote: post #2

I realize that feelings of loyalty to an employer can skew one's perspective on things. (Oh boy, do I.) You need to hear someone say this, so I'll be a bit blunt: 1) You are being drastically underpaid relative to your market worth. 2) The fact of you being underpaid will cause material hardship for your wife and children. 3) Your boss is exploiting you. Illegally, to boot. 4) Your boss will not stop exploiting you.…

"you CAN negotiate, it isn't evil"

This is generally an option, but in this case it is not in the original poster's best interest to negotiate. The only proper course of action is to leave. His employer has demonstrated how he prefers to do business and that's not going to change. Negotiation can win you the battle, but there will be plenty more down the line. Might as well get hired by more scrupulous employers (and there are plenty and the job market is good).

Re: Ask HN: Typical Startup or Abuse?

#85

Post by datawalke »

brown9-2 wrote: post #80

Everyone else has already said how abusive this is, and hit the nail on the head with it, so I won't add to it, but I would like to say one thing: You are worth far more as an employee than the meager salary and horrible relationship this guy has given you. Until you realize this, you will continue to be abused by future employers. You'll only be treated as well or as poorly as you let people treat you. Hell, I am a…

nods Thank you.

This experience on HN has been extra eye opening for me.

Re: Ask HN: Typical Startup or Abuse?

#86

Post by lkrubner »

lkrubner wrote: post #81
lkrubner wrote: post #79

I am confused by this: "and I am still making around $500/week. Which, in the beginning was great. However over the past year I have moved out, bought a car (out of need, the other died), gotten married, and have had a child. (With a second one on the way.)" Why would you have 2 children if you are making $500 a week? Does your spouse make a lot of money? Do you live in one of the developed countries, or a 3rd world…

Oh, I see this: "He still gives all of us a 1099." The 1099 is a form given out by the IRS in the USA. So you are in the USA. What the hell? Why would you have 2 kids on $500 a week in the USA?

You write:

"With this job I got myself into this nasty living paycheck-to-paycheck situation."

No, no. The job is awful, but that is not what put you in a paycheck-to-paycheck situation. Outside of New York, LA and San Francisco, a single individual can get by and be minimally comfortable on $500 a week. I've done it. When I was younger, I actually had some great times living on $500 a week. I could even save up for trips elsewhere. But having 2 kids changes things. A lot.

Having 2 kids makes it much more important that you immediately go find something that pays better.

Re: Ask HN: Typical Startup or Abuse?

#87

Post by datawalke »

lkrubner wrote: post #79

I am confused by this: "and I am still making around $500/week. Which, in the beginning was great. However over the past year I have moved out, bought a car (out of need, the other died), gotten married, and have had a child. (With a second one on the way.)" Why would you have 2 children if you are making $500 a week? Does your spouse make a lot of money? Do you live in one of the developed countries, or a 3rd world…

As alexwyser said, I'm a bit odd.

My wife first got Pregnant a few months after I got this job. (I worked there a bit over 14 months now. The first two months were really just be doing a design or two. for them.) Before this job the money from the other startups was even more sporadic. This, was almost a relief, having a solid amount of money per week at a job where I could do what I liked. (The area has few other tech companies.)

And you are completely rational in saying that it is irrational to expect to live on $500/week with two kids. However it is absolutely possible to do with one child, trust me. At the time this was the safest thing for us to do. My wife breast feeds, cloth diapers, and stays at home with our daughter. (If you ever have a child the first two will save you a significant amount of money.)

We just found out about the second child being on the way. This plays into my emotions and thoughts on having to do something about the situation I am currently in.

Re: Ask HN: Typical Startup or Abuse?

#88

Post by datawalke »

lkrubner wrote: post #86
lkrubner wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh, I see this: "He still gives all of us a 1099." The 1099 is a form given out by the IRS in the USA. So you are in the USA. What the hell? Why would you have 2 kids on $500 a week in the USA?

You write: "With this job I got myself into this nasty living paycheck-to-paycheck situation." No, no. The job is awful, but that is not what put you in a paycheck-to-paycheck situation. Outside of New York, LA and San Francisco, a single individual can get by and be minimally comfortable on $500 a week. I've done it. When I was younger, I actually had some great times living on $500 a week. I could even save up for…

> Having 2 kids makes it much more important that you immediately go find something that pays better.

And that is where I am headed.

Re: Ask HN: Typical Startup or Abuse?

#89

Post by crikli »

I'm a founder and I'd like to throatpunch your employer. Everything that has been already said is true. What he's doing is illegal.

And hey, if the opensource CMS in question is Drupal, shoot me an email, I'm always on the prowl for good Drupallers.

Re: Ask HN: Typical Startup or Abuse?

#90

Post by gommm »

I would give him an ultimatum, either quit you job right now (since you're not an employee you don't even have to give a two weeks notice) or get 2 times your salary.

After that, regardless of the outcome start looking for another job, because once you have forced his hand like this the founder is likely to find a way to not need you anymore and fire you sooner or later...

Because he needs you, he's likely to agree to your terms (as long as you don't repeat it to another), and you'll be in a better financial position while looking for a new job

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