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Less.js will obsolete CSS

fadeyev.net

41–50 of 131 posts

Re: Less.js will obsolete CSS

#41
post #13

Sensationalist link-bait headlines have no place here IMHO.

59 points and (at the time of writing) top post would indicate some disagree

Provided HN was meant to be a non-discriminatory democracy, but it to my knowledge was not. Any news site not systematically filtering content to suit a specific, targeted demographic will sooner or later inevitably converge against Digg (or die like the usenet).

Re: Less.js will obsolete CSS

#42
post #4

Literally the only problem with CSS itself is that it doesn't have defines. Every other problem is just browser implementations.

Literally? I don't think so.

CSS has very weak layout capabilities.

CSS has weak typography.

CSS has weak colour system support.

In each case, this is partly due to limitations in the underlying model, but also partly due to having limited syntax.

In each case CSS3 modules may improve things somewhat if and when they are widely supported, but even the best proposals there aren't even close to the power of a good DTP tool or the control of a native application. When the web is trying to take over from both, CSS isn't a good tool, it's just the best we've got right now.

Re: Less.js will obsolete CSS

#43
post #35
post #31

Obsolete isn't a verb.

Says who? http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/obsoleted http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/obsolete

Obsolete is a verb, but it is a poor choice. A better choice would be obsolesce, as in: "LESS.js will obsolesce CSS". This is because LESS.js won't obsolete CSS, but it may well start the industry on the path. Obsolete has a feeling of immediacy to it, and obsolesce has a feeling of lethargy or a gradual process which is why it's the better choice.

It's an opinion, take it with a grain of salt.

(BTW, I dislike MW because it takes all nuance out of the language and dumbs it down to an inexpressive mess.)

Re: Less.js will obsolete CSS

#45
post #43
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Says who? http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/obsoleted http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/obsolete

Obsolete is a verb, but it is a poor choice. A better choice would be obsolesce, as in: "LESS.js will obsolesce CSS". This is because LESS.js won't obsolete CSS, but it may well start the industry on the path. Obsolete has a feeling of immediacy to it, and obsolesce has a feeling of lethargy or a gradual process which is why it's the better choice. It's an opinion, take it with a grain of salt. (BTW, I dislike MW bec…

"Mr. Wolfe is in the middle of a fit. It's complicated. There's a fireplace in the front room, but it's never lit because he hates open fires. He says they stultify mental processes. But it's lit now because he's using it. He's seated in front of it, on a chair too small for him, tearing sheets out of a book and burning them. The book is the new edition, the third edition, of Webster's New International Dictionary, Unabridged, published by the G. & C. Merriam Company of Springfield, Massachusetts. He considers it subversive because it threatens the integrity of the English language. In the past week he has given me a thousand examples of its crimes. He says it is a deliberate attempt to murder the — I beg your pardon. I describe the situation at length because he told me to bring you in there, and it will be bad."

Re: Less.js will obsolete CSS

#47
post #4

Literally the only problem with CSS itself is that it doesn't have defines. Every other problem is just browser implementations.

The lack of a proper layout system causes a huge number of problems, and is the reason the "tables vs. css" argument can still occasionally pop up. The nuts box model has already been mentioned.

Re: Less.js will obsolete CSS

#48
post #24
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is genuinely a tiny benefit because you don't need to declare colors etc more than once, everything else about it is trying to wedge ideas from other areas of programming into a language that contains so many abstract concepts as to not benefit from it at all. I've worked as a UI developer for 12 years now and I wouldn't go near something like this because there is no value. At least the server side version you…

Let me give an example use case, something I've wanted. Lots of developers will tell you that it's fine to use systems like the 960 Grid System for rapid prototyping, but you shouldn't use them for final, "production" sites. Their argument is that "littering" your code with classes like "grid_4", etc. is not semantic (and they're right). So here's what I would love to do: use a system like 960 in development, but ins…

I'll give another example with mixins: clearfix. I've seen webpages littered with class="clearfix" all over the HTML. That doesn't do anybody any good. With a CSS preprocessor you can define a clearfix mixin and just write it something like:

.class-name .clearfix font-size: 1.2em

There are other ways to do it like one long string of selectors followed by the clearfix code, but they're not as convenient or readable.

Re: Less.js will obsolete CSS

#49
I can see it being somewhat useful as a server-side technology or as an authoring tool that you can then "compile" to CSS. CSS is so straightforward and simple to use as-is, however, that I don't really think it needs something to make it even easier, although the support for variables is quite nice.

Having said that, I have the same problem with LESS.js that I have with various other JavaScript layout techniques - I simply don't like relying on JavaScript to control the look and feel of a web page. I think it's awkward, inefficient, and just asking for trouble. Mostly, I also think it's completely unnecessary.

Re: Less.js will obsolete CSS

#50
post #35
post #31

Obsolete isn't a verb.

Says who? http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/obsoleted http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/obsolete

MW adds practically any word that someone uses, ever. And Wiktionary? Come on.

If you take a gander at WordNet or even OneLook (searches multiple dictionaries), you'll find that the majority list obsolete only as an adjective, including Webster's 1828.

However, I concur that obsolesce would have been a better choice.

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