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Uber Posts $708M Loss as Finance Head Leaves

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Re: Uber Posts $708M Loss as Finance Head Leaves

#161

Post by im3w1l »

bitJericho wrote: post #35
randomdrake wrote: post #15

Great example of how the headlines can drive a story more than the story itself. While Uber may have posted $708 million of losses, it is also up 18% in revenue from last quarter. That's 3.4 billion dollars in the first quarter of 2017. Uber is making approximately $1,500,000 per hour. I dislike Uber as much as the next person for ethical reasons, but a company that can achieve millions of dollars in revenue per day,…

I buy gas from across the street for 3 dollars a gallon. I sell it for 2. I sell 1.5 million dollars an hour. My business is doing great.

I think the problem is that you are not doing any value-add, or refinement. If you were somehow enhancing the gas, at a loss, then the example isn't so ridiculous.

Re: Uber Posts $708M Loss as Finance Head Leaves

#162

Post by johan_larson »

ewoodrich wrote: post #77
bla2 wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1. Click "web" link below story here on HN 2. Click first result on Google WSJ doesn't paywall if the referrer is Google.

FWIW, I still hit the paywall after clicking on the Google search result.

Yes, I don't think that trick has worked for some time.

Re: Uber Posts $708M Loss as Finance Head Leaves

#164

Post by CaptainZapp »

shaggerty wrote: post #67
skinnymuch wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not buying that most people use Lyft in your area - passengers or drivers. I believe you think that and your circle of people may also be doing the same, but beyond that, I'm guessing there's a lot of bias. Especially if you're saying everywhere you go Lyft seems to be more popular among riders. It's just not true at all. For my own anecdote, I'd bet 75% of my FB friends with smartphones within my age range, 21-4…

I wouldn't doubt it, Uber comes preinstalled on most android phones.

Came pre-installed on my Lumia phone too.

And was the second app, which I deleted. Right after Facebook.

Re: Uber Posts $708M Loss as Finance Head Leaves

#165

Post by samastur »

dismantlethesun wrote: post #80
objclxt wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's certainly true - things like Pool make it easier to obfuscate the cut Uber takes. But still, price rises don't just have a potential to alienate passengers, but drivers as well. If anything, drivers may well be more fickle than passengers, since someone who takes Uber once or twice a week has less to lose than someone driving for them 8 hours a day.

True but a 6% increase overboard is practically invisible. Will you notice if you pay $7.51 one day, and 7.96 the next day? What with all the surge pricing, route changes, time of day pricing, and other schemes Uber throws at you, you're lucky to get the same price day to day.

If they are so invisible not to matter, then why aren't they higher already? Why would Uber lose money if they didn't feel like they have to?

Re: Uber Posts $708M Loss as Finance Head Leaves

#166

Post by dx034 »

jpatokal wrote: post #130
beager wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe that Lyft doesn't have to compete globally with Uber to be a successful business in its own right. I also believe that Uber isn't immune from being crippled by competitors that operate in a very small but key subset of Uber's markets. There is very little network effect with Uber. Sure, you can hop off a plane anywhere in the world and open Uber to get a car, but that is a very small number of people overal…

You're ignoring that businessmen who travel all the time are very heavy users of Uber and similar services. I'm not even a frequent flyer, but I'd estimate that a good 80-90% of my Uber usage is travel-related. At home, I have tons of other options to get around, but on a tight schedule in an unfamiliar city, I basically default to Uber all the time, because I rarely have the time or risk tolerance explore alternativ…

As a business traveller you don't really care about the price as it's paid by your employer. So you'll take the fastest and most comfortable option. In many cities that's still a cab as they are much faster to get at airports than Ubers.

The other alternative are exec cars which Uber offers but which will often be pre-booked locally.

I think Uber could get many business travellers on board if they'd offer some rewards system (similar to airlines). Otherwise there's no reason to be loyal to Uber if a local cab or some other hire service (e.g. Lyft, Addison Lee in London) are faster to use.

Re: Uber Posts $708M Loss as Finance Head Leaves

#167

Post by dx034 »

askafriend wrote: post #99
abhv wrote: post #14

They haven't broken out the losses. (a) Are they profitable in the US? That would be a huge milestone. (b) If not entire US, are they profitable in top-X US urban markets, and thus losses are all due to expansion into 2nd/3rd quartile of cities? (c) Maybe some metrics like "After subtracting R&D efforts in self-driving cars, and legal fees due to multiple lawsuits, we are on average making X cents for every mile/minu…

From internal sources, I can say with some confidence that they are profitable in most major US cities. (I do not work for Uber, so take this for what it's worth)

Is that under the old accounting system (which paid out too little to drivers) or the correct one?

Re: Uber Posts $708M Loss as Finance Head Leaves

#168

Post by dx034 »

pfarnsworth wrote: post #101
mrep wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People were saying the same thing about Twitter forever and turned out to be largely wrong. Twitter lost 456 million dollars in 2016 [1] and I don't remember them ever being profitable so i don't know how those people are wrong. [1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twitter

If you look, their losses are because of stock-based comp, not because of spending. It's generally a GAAP loss, not a cash loss.

It still means that their owners won't see any of the money generated by the company. Before compensation, most companies are profitable. And in the end it doesn't matter to the shareholder if you pay stock compensation or cash.

Re: Uber Posts $708M Loss as Finance Head Leaves

#169

Post by dx034 »

IAmGraydon wrote: post #66
nullnilvoid wrote: post #12

Revenue: $3.4B Loss: $708M Growth: 18% Quarter over quarter Cash to burn: $7.2B With the current burn rate, Uber can burn another 10 quarters.

That would be at 0% growth, which is unlikely.

If much of the growth comes from Pool (where gross fares count as revenues, not their cut), growing revenue could actually increase losses.

Re: Uber Posts $708M Loss as Finance Head Leaves

#170

Post by dx034 »

rtx wrote: post #90
ProfessorLayton wrote: post #10

I wonder how they'll be able to raise more cash with all this turmoil within the company. Even a 15B [1] cash hoard can't last much longer at this burn rate. [1] https://mobile.nytimes.com/2016/06/21/business/dealbook/why-...

People are standing in line.

People who are willing to take a substantial share at a $70bn valuation? I'm not so sure about that. An IPO could be their only chance to raise significant amounts of capital. They'll need to use the time they have with their current cash balance (~2 years) to look good enough for an IPO.
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