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How to Sleep

theatlantic.com

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Re: How to Sleep

#201

Post by iman453 »

voidz wrote: post #198
_flbt wrote: post #166

I could write an essay about my battle with sleep. I'm in my 30's and I finally think it's solved. Sleeping meds, sleep studies, CBT-I, you name it - I've done it. My ultimate solution ended up being: - Earplugs - Exercise - Waking up the same time every single day, no matter how late I stay up. CBT-I had me wake up at 6:30 am every morning, and go to bed at 1 am. After a week of exhaustion, I started falling asleep…

Earplugs are my #1 life changer when it comes to sleep. I found these really soft ones that don't really get in the way when you're lying on one ear, they filter pretty much all of the sound and when I take them out the next day, my ears don't hurt. As it turns out my wife's breathing kept me kind of awake, and traffic sounds too. And now that I got used to it, thanks to the associativity of the brain, these days I f…

Could you tell me which earplugs you use and how you went about finding the right ones?

Re: How to Sleep

#202

Post by michaelmior »

rubber_duck wrote: post #199
laughfactory wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is me, too. My wife complains that it's like I'm trying to have two or three lives instead of just the one. But I know I need the sleep I'm not getting, but I have a really hard time, once the kids are finally asleep, just going to bed myself. When everyone but me is asleep it's so peaceful and quiet, and I can read, slay work dragons, learn stuff, or just veg. Unfortunately this usually results in maybe six low…

Is ~6 hours low ? After I started working out before work I started getting up ~6-6:30 but I can't go to sleep much earlier than 12 (I just end up rolling around in bed) - but I've been doing this for so long now I can't really tell the difference. I sleep over on the weekends but I don't notice extra productivity or being rested. I'll try to go to sleep at 22:30 this week to see if I feel different.

As the article mentioned, "low" is relative as different people require different amounts of sleep. 6 hours might be totally fine for you while someone else would be a complete zombie.

Re: How to Sleep

#203

Post by amiga-workbench »

RandomInteger4 wrote: post #15

I'm not sure what the long term effects of chronic melatonin supplementation are, but I'll find out eventually. I've been taking between 3-6mg of melatonin every night for the past few years (2011?) It's almost required. Without it my sleep cycle seems fine at first, but then gets out of whack as I can't seem to keep a circadian rhythm in line with the rest of society / the earth's rotation. On the opposite end of th…

Melatonin doesn't seem to be ideal for me. I'm taking 3mg and while it does knock me out fairly quickly, I'll wake up only a few hours later and find it almost impossible to get back to sleep again. I'm usually even more tired than I would have been without it.

I've cut caffeine completely out of my diet and I'm finding it very difficult to concentrate, theres a fog in my brain which only occasionally lifts (and on those days I get loads done)

Re: How to Sleep

#204

Post by ekms »

_flbt wrote: post #166

I could write an essay about my battle with sleep. I'm in my 30's and I finally think it's solved. Sleeping meds, sleep studies, CBT-I, you name it - I've done it. My ultimate solution ended up being: - Earplugs - Exercise - Waking up the same time every single day, no matter how late I stay up. CBT-I had me wake up at 6:30 am every morning, and go to bed at 1 am. After a week of exhaustion, I started falling asleep…

I've also had persistent sleep problems over the years. Tried pretty much every behavioral approach (including the ones you've listed), as well as melatonin, marijuana, anti-histamines.

Those things maybe helped to an extent, but they contributed to an overall attitude that sleep was something I could _induce_ if only I did the right things, took the right pills, exercised at the right times, avoided the wrong things.

The thing that really seemed to begin to improve my sleep pattern was meditation. Gradually I've become more comfortable with not falling asleep quickly, which has the funny effect of often allowing the mind to fall sleep quicker. I still follow the conventional behavioral advice, but I think reframing my attitude towards sleep via meditation/mindfulness was really the most important step for me.

Re: How to Sleep

#205

Post by alltakendamned »

iman453 wrote: post #201
voidz wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Earplugs are my #1 life changer when it comes to sleep. I found these really soft ones that don't really get in the way when you're lying on one ear, they filter pretty much all of the sound and when I take them out the next day, my ears don't hurt. As it turns out my wife's breathing kept me kind of awake, and traffic sounds too. And now that I got used to it, thanks to the associativity of the brain, these days I f…

Could you tell me which earplugs you use and how you went about finding the right ones?

I use the foam earplugs from Quies.

https://www.quies.com/product/foam-earplugs/

Re: How to Sleep

#206

Post by RandomInteger4 »

suneilp wrote: post #120
RandomInteger4 wrote: post #15

I'm not sure what the long term effects of chronic melatonin supplementation are, but I'll find out eventually. I've been taking between 3-6mg of melatonin every night for the past few years (2011?) It's almost required. Without it my sleep cycle seems fine at first, but then gets out of whack as I can't seem to keep a circadian rhythm in line with the rest of society / the earth's rotation. On the opposite end of th…

If your sleep cycle goes out of whack without melatonin, that sounds like a dysfunctional pineal gland. What are you doing in terms of diet? Consider working with a doctor who practices functional medicine that will look for underlying causes like chemical imbalances/deficiencies (like nutrients and minerals)

For the most part, my diet is generally on the healthy-ish side; brown rice, beans, eggs, protein shakes with lactose-free milk, oats, cocoa powder, and activia.

Veggies include onions, carrots, cabbage, split peas, lentils, and broccoli / collard greens.

Also natural peanut butter and sunflower seeds to varying degrees.

Re: How to Sleep

#207

Post by Bartweiss »

laughfactory wrote: post #131
teolandon wrote: post #59

My biggest struggle with sleep is that I'm always excited to do stuff, and always feel like I'm not done with my day. Exceptions are when something happens and I end up feeling very depressed during the day, and simply want to shut down and do nothing. Usually, I get so infatuated with a script I'm writing, a new program I discovered, a bug that I need to resolve, a book that I'm reading, some concept that I'm thinki…

This is me, too. My wife complains that it's like I'm trying to have two or three lives instead of just the one. But I know I need the sleep I'm not getting, but I have a really hard time, once the kids are finally asleep, just going to bed myself. When everyone but me is asleep it's so peaceful and quiet, and I can read, slay work dragons, learn stuff, or just veg. Unfortunately this usually results in maybe six low…

> But overcoming the size of deficit I've got isn't pleasant either. I actually feel worse much of the time.

I'm glad I'm not alone in this. On a stable, moderate sleep deficit (often 6 hours, like you), I feel ok. I'm used to it, I'm not exhausted, it's alright. I pay in attentiveness and memory, but it's bearable.

As I start to dig out, I feel like shit. I don't know if it's the changing schedule or some 'expectation' from my body of actually good sleep, but I feel groggy, distractable, and generally useless. It takes many days of consistent recovery (often ~9 hours) to shake that off, and only a few days of error to fall back into the routine.

Re: How to Sleep

#208

Post by voidz »

Antrikshy wrote: post #90
ashark wrote: post #25

1) no glowing screens at all after the sun goes down. 2) no glowing screens at all after the sun goes down. 3) no glowing screens at all after the sun goes down. 4) very low candle-temperature lighting only after dark. Especially try to keep it out of your direct line of sight. It'll work, but 1-3 are hard .

I mean, what am I supposed to do in my leisure time if I can't look at glowing screens? Just sit around and pretend I'm in the 90s?

We watched TV in the 90s. Lots and lots. Try the 40s.

Re: How to Sleep

#209

Post by Bartweiss »

rubber_duck wrote: post #199
laughfactory wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is me, too. My wife complains that it's like I'm trying to have two or three lives instead of just the one. But I know I need the sleep I'm not getting, but I have a really hard time, once the kids are finally asleep, just going to bed myself. When everyone but me is asleep it's so peaceful and quiet, and I can read, slay work dragons, learn stuff, or just veg. Unfortunately this usually results in maybe six low…

Is ~6 hours low ? After I started working out before work I started getting up ~6-6:30 but I can't go to sleep much earlier than 12 (I just end up rolling around in bed) - but I've been doing this for so long now I can't really tell the difference. I sleep over on the weekends but I don't notice extra productivity or being rested. I'll try to go to sleep at 22:30 this week to see if I feel different.

Personal needs vary, but also know that you can stabilize on chronic low sleep and not even know it. I did a few years getting ~6 hours most days, and felt ok. I eventually ended up getting 8-9 for quite a while (months), recovered, and now quite literally feel better than I knew I could.

A simple, funny example: I always thought I was prone to getting songs stuck in my head. It turns out I'm not unless I'm sleep deprived, but that was such a constant state that I never knew there was an alternative.

Re: How to Sleep

#210

Post by voidz »

hughdbrown wrote: post #44
Bakary wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can achieve the same effect as the documentary by focusing on your breathing. Starting at 100, you count down with each breath. I've never gotten to zero after years of trying. Amusingly the stereotypical sheep counting method works wonders as well when your thoughts won't give you a break.

I can count a long way down by ones. The pattern is too obvious -- as it also is with even numbers, three, five, nine, ten. I find that counting down by 7s from 1000 does the trick. I can never get to 600 like that before I am asleep.

Yeah, or as someone else suggested too, reasonably easy math formulas like Fibonacci. I also used to advice this to my mates if they had too much to drink and became nauseous when trying to fall asleep.
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