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Declassified memos show FBI illegally shared spy data with private parties

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Re: Declassified memos show FBI illegally shared spy data with private parties

#41

Post by nickpsecurity »

rhizome wrote: post #26
CamperBob2 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One wonders: is there ANY point at which the Congress or even the Courts will step in and say that the abuse has been excessive? Yes, and it's happened before: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_Committee The LE and intelligence agencies just go back to doing exactly what they were doing, with zero accountability as usual, and nothing really changes. Except they get a little bit better at covering their tracks.

Now consider how bad it had to get before the Church Committee was convened.

MKULTRA. Iran-Contra. CIA supporting the drug trade. People threatening any of that getting assassinated. It's hard to tell if it was worse, though, given all the things exposed over past 10-20 years. If anything, public resistance seems to have gone down a lot.

Re: Declassified memos show FBI illegally shared spy data with private parties

#42

Post by nickpsecurity »

SomeStupidPoint wrote: post #6
killin_dan wrote: post #3

Oh lord, this is so shocking! /s Why is state intelligence even a thing? The military is capable of gathering all of the defensive intelligence that we need to protect ourselves. These state cowboys are out there making deals and cracking my WiFi to see what porn I'm watching in the name of counter-terror. Nonviolent threats do not necessitate or validate state intelligence imo.

Because the military isn't supposed to act domestically under normal circumstances, to prevent other kinds of abuses. So we have a federal police organization separate from the military, theoretically trained to obey the rules of domestic operations (eg, constitutional protections). And it is that police organization which handles intelligence about, eg, terrorism and foreign spies that originates inside of the count…

"So we have a federal police organization separate from the military, theoretically trained to obey the rules of domestic operations "

Interesting enough, its power came from public relations, military and intelligence-style operations against its opponents under J Edgar Hoover. The story you told came as propaganda supporting that. I agree with separating military and law enforcement plus different procedures. It's just that the FBI was more like a foreign opponent shoring up power for itself, esp its leader, than a traditional LEO w/ federal power given for legitimate reasons. Then, it kept and expanded on that power despite how it achieved it in the first place.

Re: Declassified memos show FBI illegally shared spy data with private parties

#43

Post by narrowrail »

killin_dan wrote: post #32
lightbyte wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Why is state intelligence even a thing? The military is capable of gathering all of the defensive intelligence that we need to protect ourselves. What are you saying? The military IS the state.

Not even close to the actual intelligence structure. The nsa doesn't have to answer to dod at ALL. Hurr durr the military is the state, you have no clue what you're talking about. I served for 6 years doing naval intelligence, sigint, and we never once heard from nsa, cia, fbi, etc. All our orders came from one of two generals in charge of our task force. Nuclear subs night have to work with intel agencies for techni…

I don't have the experience you do, but all of the big violent acts we have had over the last 20 years that I remember were perpetrated by US citizens (except 9/11).

I agree that we should not shape our laws based on edge-case criteria (e.g comic book villains), but their has to be some cross-state law enforcement.

Re: Declassified memos show FBI illegally shared spy data with private parties

#45

Post by narrowrail »

Mendenhall wrote: post #38

Whats interesting and very telling is the medias coverage of this.

Or lack there of. They're busy getting hysterical over the highly damning allegations of the day that is our current 'NightmareTV' political situation.

Because the Obama admin was implicated in it, the coverage seems to be broad in Republican circles (i.e. Fox News). I wish us non-tribal people could form some common-sense, bipartisan group.

Edit: added less ambiguous descriptors.

Re: Declassified memos show FBI illegally shared spy data with private parties

#46

Post by 1001101 »

philipov wrote: post #18
CWuestefeld wrote: post #13

One wonders: is there ANY point at which the Congress or even the Courts will step in and say that the abuse has been excessive? Is there really any threshold, and they're just waiting to see if we reach it? I'm really starting to believe that there's no limit at all. It's the proverbial frog in hot water.

If I were in charge of an intelligence agency, I imagine the most interesting targets of surveillance would be congresspeople and judges.

And, indeed, they are.

Re: Declassified memos show FBI illegally shared spy data with private parties

#47

Post by rhizome »

nickpsecurity wrote: post #40
rhizome wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The systematic benefits in US society are dispersed from the top down, and its sacrifices emerge from the bottom up.

Are you quoting someone with that comment? Because it looks to be a great statement to quote. Only thing I could add is possibly turning the 'and' into a 'but.'

AFAIK it's mine.

'But' could work, but it feels a little too mutually-exclusive in context.

Re: Declassified memos show FBI illegally shared spy data with private parties

#48

Post by mindcrime »

djjdiud wrote: post #5

52 points 2 hours and this is on page two. Not a big surprise given how pro Government HN commenters can be.

FWIW, there are 2 or 3 libertarians / voluntaryists / anarcho-capitalists / whatever left hanging around... so not everybody is pro-government here.

Re: Declassified memos show FBI illegally shared spy data with private parties

#49

Post by tnakjtn9 »

nstj wrote: post #44

I'd never heard of Circa (circa.com, the publisher of the story) before, so did a little digging. Apparently it's owned by Sinclair Broadcast Group [0]. [0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinclair_Broadcast_Group

Which it should be noted is a fairly politically conservative organization. [1]

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinclair_Broadcast_Group#Polit...

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