Just say ‘non’: The problem with French immersion (2015)
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Re: Just say ‘non’: The problem with French immersion (2015)
#2>Hannah Spencer isn’t the kind of mom who leaves anything to chance.
So already we start off with a control freak who tries to defy the (random) nature of reality.
>rentice arrived at 8:30 a.m. on Sunday, three days before registration opened, and was the seventh parent in line for the 17 kindergarten openings.
My goodness, that is like apple store, but with schools. Hipsterism, planted right into the brain of your child!
>Outside Quebec, bilingual men earn on average 3.8 per cent more than their unilingual counterparts, according to a 2010 study out of the University of Guelph.
Worth sacrificing your childhood for.
Every day when I read about schools, I am so damn grateful I am an adult and out of this insane institution.
Re: Just say ‘non’: The problem with French immersion (2015)
#3>Hannah Spencer isn’t the kind of mom who leaves anything to chance. So already we start off with a control freak who tries to defy the (random) nature of reality. >rentice arrived at 8:30 a.m. on Sunday, three days before registration opened, and was the seventh parent in line for the 17 kindergarten openings. My goodness, that is like apple store, but with schools. Hipsterism, planted right into the brain of your c…
> Worth sacrificing your childhood for.
Is that specific to French immersion? I don't see what that has to do with the quoted text. If your child is already spending their childhood in school, you should at least try to help them get the most out of it...
Re: Just say ‘non’: The problem with French immersion (2015)
#4Just a warning to readers that MacLean's is fairly anti-french/Quebec so take this article with a grain of salt.
It also glosses over the main issue which is streaming. If a group of children is smarter than their peers is it right to force them to learn at the same pace as their slower peers and vice-versa. French immersion in English speaking Canada is a streaming tool to get around the fact that classes are not streamed and parents want their kids to get ahead and don't want "dumb" kids slowing them down. Many other countries like France and Germany IIRC are highly streamed and the article points to Europe as a place where leaning additional languages in childhood has been quite successful.
Re: Just say ‘non’: The problem with French immersion (2015)
#5For a USA-ian, it is interesting to see similar issues for language
immersion (in Canada) and US voucher-based charter schools, each relative
to the local traditional schools, with a tendency for students from
higher-income families to attend immersion (in Canada) or voucher-based
charter schools (in the US), and for traditional schools to retain
students from lower-income families, allophone/ESL students, and a higher
proportion of students with special needs.
While I'm in favor of exploring innovation in education, it seems like there are intrinsic challenges to equity here, and a situation that cries out for methods to equitably balance access to effective education.
[edited to clarify which schools in which country]
Re: Just say ‘non’: The problem with French immersion (2015)
#6It's funny, because the reverse issue exists within Quebec. I can't say how much better (or worse) it got recently recently, but I know that 15 years ago English classes in primary and high school were very, very underwhelming. I'm lucky enough that my school had an advanced curriculum available, but I have friends that didn't have this chance and even today they wouldn't be able to have a basic conversion in English. I think learning another language is great, especially when you're young since you have plenty of time to do it at that age.
Re: Just say ‘non’: The problem with French immersion (2015)
#7For a USA-ian, it is interesting to see similar issues for language immersion (in Canada) and US voucher-based charter schools, each relative to the local traditional schools, with a tendency for students from higher-income families to attend immersion (in Canada) or voucher-based charter schools (in the US), and for traditional schools to retain students from lower-income families, allophone/ESL students, and a high…
FWIW, not all immersion programs in the US are charter based. Our kids went to a public non-charter Spanish immersion school K-8 here in San Jose, and entry into the school was split equally between native English and native Spanish speakers. That meant there was good diversity in socio-economic backgrounds without any direct "racial profiling". (Note there were also some upper-income native Spanish speakers in the program, mostly kids of immigrants from Spain and South America.)
Re: Just say ‘non’: The problem with French immersion (2015)
#8Just a warning to readers that MacLean's is fairly anti-french/Quebec so take this article with a grain of salt. It also glosses over the main issue which is streaming. If a group of children is smarter than their peers is it right to force them to learn at the same pace as their slower peers and vice-versa. French immersion in English speaking Canada is a streaming tool to get around the fact that classes are not st…
Taken from Wikipedia:
"Since lower socioeconomic groups and children with learning and behavioral problems have lower rates of participation in French immersion, a situation has developed in which ambitious families might prefer French immersion for its effective streaming than for the bilingual skills it gives to students."
I don't see how this is a problem, as you've noted it.
Re: Just say ‘non’: The problem with French immersion (2015)
#9It's funny, because the reverse issue exists within Quebec. I can't say how much better (or worse) it got recently recently, but I know that 15 years ago English classes in primary and high school were very, very underwhelming. I'm lucky enough that my school had an advanced curriculum available, but I have friends that didn't have this chance and even today they wouldn't be able to have a basic conversion in English…
Youth is the best time to learn new languages too, they're harder to acquire later in life for some reason.
Re: Just say ‘non’: The problem with French immersion (2015)
#10Just a warning to readers that MacLean's is fairly anti-french/Quebec so take this article with a grain of salt. It also glosses over the main issue which is streaming. If a group of children is smarter than their peers is it right to force them to learn at the same pace as their slower peers and vice-versa. French immersion in English speaking Canada is a streaming tool to get around the fact that classes are not st…
Yep. "The line ups might come back". The reason there's no line up this year isn't because there aren't enough students, it's because BC has done away with first come first serve, and is now doing a lottery system.