81–90 of 189 posts
Just a note, this isnt about firing junior people fast. That is absolutely scummy. This is about hiring/firing very senior, well paid people with lots of prior experience. If you are hiring and then firing junior people fast, you are the problem.
Actually, pretty good advice in the opposite direction, too. If I had known at 18 that I could have easily and successfully walked away from teams, bosses, companies, partners, and investors who gave 'bad vibes', I would easily have (at least!) an extra couple million in the bank. I wasted countless opportunities waiting for things to get better, when I probably intuitively knew that they wouldn't. Partly, it was bec…
Thank you for saying this. Honestly, probably could have cut a total of four years of waste out of my life by just knowing the company was not a good fit for me. I used to stay at a place and say "Ok, maybe its me, what can I do to put the most effort in, and maybe that will change how upper level toxic management trickles down and fundamentally changes how politics over rule technology and data based decisions, or h…
I have never regretted it and only feel relief whenever I think about it. I walked straight into another job.
If I were to stop freelancing and get a job again, I would just leave it off my CV.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
>My next company will have explicit rubrics for what it takes to get fired, and your status will be tracked daily >You'll know at all times exactly how close you are to getting fired with how much severance Good luck getting anyone to stick around! People want job security, they don't want to feel like they're walking on eggshells every day. You seem to think the only thing people want out of a job is money. >Anyone…
>It's a serious legal risk to re-hire fired employees. That's interesting to hear. Could you explain in what way?
This post left a bad taste in my mouth. Firing can be hard on all parties involved. Your dumb startup is not that important. If you can't figure out how to utilize an employee, that's on you.
You're right that firing is hard for everyone. It creates an environment of chaos and uncertainty, which if it is not properly managed, may precipitate scores of top employees to shift to job-search-mode.
FWIW, however, I do think a lot more high-level execs (which is what the article is _really_ about rather than juniors) need to on the chopping block earlier and more often. At the very least it may help to promote more empathy about hiring people that have been laid-off as these people climb their way back into leadership positions.
Weirdly, I think we would all benefit quite a lot from a normalization of fast firing. Part of the reason it's hard to get a job is that companies are afraid to fire you, so they jump through all kinds of strange hoops to try to predict how good an employee you'll be based on, really, no information. This also forces companies to filter out "possibly good" candidates and only hire "probably good" candidates. If it we…
how is it "hard" to fire in the USA
Just a note, this isnt about firing junior people fast. That is absolutely scummy. This is about hiring/firing very senior, well paid people with lots of prior experience. If you are hiring and then firing junior people fast, you are the problem.
I just want to add that if you fire them before giving them any feedback and a chance to improve you are just as bad.
One time someone said "Yes, I am surprised you fired me." I can't even tell you how destructive that was to my team. To be honest that person should never had been surprised nor my leadership team, but it happened and it caused havoc. It took years to fully repair the damage. I think he just really liked the job and didn't want to leave. Also the person ended up going to jail for unethical practices just 18 months later. I actually fired him due to being full of excuses or on the line of disaster and never asking for help.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Thank you for saying this. Honestly, probably could have cut a total of four years of waste out of my life by just knowing the company was not a good fit for me. I used to stay at a place and say "Ok, maybe its me, what can I do to put the most effort in, and maybe that will change how upper level toxic management trickles down and fundamentally changes how politics over rule technology and data based decisions, or h…
As a senior programmer with a bit more life experience, I quit somewhere after only 2 months. They valued me, the pay was great, the tech challenges were interesting, but their processes drove me potty. I have never regretted it and only feel relief whenever I think about it. I walked straight into another job. If I were to stop freelancing and get a job again, I would just leave it off my CV.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
I just want to add that if you fire them before giving them any feedback and a chance to improve you are just as bad.
"No one should ever be surprised when fired." I have unfortunately fired several people and I have always asked if they were surprised. One time someone said "Yes, I am surprised you fired me." I can't even tell you how destructive that was to my team. To be honest that person should never had been surprised nor my leadership team, but it happened and it caused havoc. It took years to fully repair the damage. I think…
Just a note, this isnt about firing junior people fast. That is absolutely scummy. This is about hiring/firing very senior, well paid people with lots of prior experience. If you are hiring and then firing junior people fast, you are the problem.
I wholeheartedly agree with this article, when it comes to execs you cannot get rid of one that does not fit fast enough. But that is the funny thing, you can take a person with proven results, stick them in a different company culture and they just don't produce. They can leave that company, go to another with a different culture and succeed all over again. With senior executives it really is all about fit.
I also agree with you, if you are burning and churning thru the bottom you have a serious culture problem and probably have some bad mid/senior management.