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Ask HN: How can I do social good through programming?

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Re: Ask HN: How can I do social good through programming?

#271

Post by nyargh »

simplicitea wrote: post #234
nyargh wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People are going to shit on the parent comment - but honestly, anyone with more than a few years of experience in a tight tech job market is going to easily be in the top decile of earners. The highly-committed individuals that do the brutally hard work on the ground for non-profits or NGOs make a pittance in comparison. Committing a quarter of your salary would pay the entirety of theirs. Consider that for a moment.

I guess I have the advantage of starting out with close to a decade of low wages doing something that I enjoy ;)... I'm definitely attracted to billboard tech wages -- but I really could get by pretty comfortably with half were I building something I had faith in.

The premise that NGOs need tech more than they need money is shaky at best.

Re: Ask HN: How can I do social good through programming?

#272

Post by Mz »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #213
Mz wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Long experience suggests they probably are not.

Why? I have exactly the same question on my mind as OP, and I'm definitely not thinking about yet another bullshit mobile app that'll save the world.

Because long experience tells me that it is inherently hard to see and measure the disasters you prevented. This makes it incredibly hard to feel like you are accomplishing anything and harder still to convince other people you are actually adding value.

Y2K was supposed to be a global meltdown. There were people who prepped for that like a coming apocalypse. It was prevented and many people remember it as "Ha! Can you believe those fools ever believed we were in real danger?!"

No one gets up today and goes "Oh, thank god they fixed that and I am not living in the Y2K post apocalypse! My ATM still works and life goes on!"

I was molested for 2.5 years as a child in part because my mother stopped being a homemaker and began doing paid work outside the house. The direct cause and effect connection is extremely clear to me not only due to first hand experience but because of extensive reading on the topic. This is part of why I was a full time homemaker until my sons were 19 and 16. No one ever molested them. There was damn little opportunity for anyone to get them alone. I made sure of it.

I get straight up told I just got lucky and do not actually know shit all about preventing bad things from happening. When I try to share such information to help other people I basically get told "Shit happens. You can't stop it. Quit blaming the victims."

Re: Ask HN: How can I do social good through programming?

#273

Post by erikpukinskis »

peacetreefrog wrote: post #216
ChuckMcM wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think Bill Gates is an interesting data point here. For a lot of his life he was reviled by many, and yet in the past 15 years he has used his wealth to do great good.

Agree that he's done a ton of good with his charitable giving, but point is that he bettered humanity (probably even more than his charity) even before that with Windows (giving the masses an easier way to interact with computers, allowing individuals and companies to create other valuable things in turn), the whole software not hardware paradigm (led to rapid development in terms of the type of programs and function…

Disagree strongly.

By killing Netscape he set back the computer industry by a decade or more. If Gates hadn't used anti-competitive tactics, and he had just accepted, say, a 60% share for Windows, we would have reached where we are much quicker.

We benefit immensely from the presence today of multiple strong operating systems, Windows, Android, iOS, MacOS, Linux, and Chrome are all great offerings that force the other players to be better.

Windows languished during its monopoly decade, and we were all stuck with it. Why did it even take until iPhone 3G for there to be a widespread online software store? Because Microsoft profited from Office being the biggest, most profitable box on a shelf with a bunch of other boxes, and having that boxed software be the only place you could direct your attention on a PC. Steve Jobs could start an online software store because Apple was barely selling any software. They had nothing to lose. Gates had the world to lose.

Look at where peoples' attention goes today. That's what Netscape was promising. Now imagine if Gates had let that happen in 1995.

And Word and Excel were clones of existing software. Microsoft had about as much positive impact on the tech industry as Baidu is having now. Baidu probably has more users than Gates ever had.

Re: Ask HN: How can I do social good through programming?

#274

Post by ChuckMcM »

simplicitea wrote: post #252
ChuckMcM wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think 'bettering humanity with Windows' is open for debate. Some would argue that Windows, and the security problems it brought to the Internet, was the enabler for the single largest source of income for criminal enterprise outside of the drug trade. Now it is much more nuanced than that, network based criminal activity has existed since the invention of the telegraph, but I would be willing to wager even on a per…

| poor update policies which ones? forcing them or not forcing them?

In the wannacry event the policy of not applying updates was contributory to its spread. So 'not forcing them' being the less good choice.

Re: Ask HN: How can I do social good through programming?

#276

Post by arglebarnacle »

sheraz wrote: post #165
hooverlunch wrote: post #162

Join or start a tech worker co-op! First, one of the best ways to do social good is to fight capitalism. Just by working at a worker co-op, you're doing this. Many tech co-ops are also built around resisting other oppressions like racism, patriarchy, etc. Second, many co-ops (e.g. http://sassafras.coop , the one I work for) work on lots of social good projects.

Yes, evil capitalism. You know, don't want to think you actually think that. Perhaps you meant, "fight the negative outcomes sometimes found in capitalist societies."

Honestly the idea that capitalism itself systematically causes inequality is not a crazy thing to believe. You obviously don't agree and that's fine, but it's not the case that every smart person believes the "negative outcomes found in capitalist societies" can be resolved without a fundamental change in the underlying system.

Re: Ask HN: How can I do social good through programming?

#277

Post by nyargh »

Mz wrote: post #272
TeMPOraL wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? I have exactly the same question on my mind as OP, and I'm definitely not thinking about yet another bullshit mobile app that'll save the world.

Because long experience tells me that it is inherently hard to see and measure the disasters you prevented. This makes it incredibly hard to feel like you are accomplishing anything and harder still to convince other people you are actually adding value. Y2K was supposed to be a global meltdown. There were people who prepped for that like a coming apocalypse. It was prevented and many people remember it as "Ha! Can y…

Sorry to hear about your experience, but you make a very salient point and I also agree that you made an enlightened (if hard earned) decision regarding the best thing you could do for your children.

In my experience there are thousands of people doing the hard work day in and day out, quietly holding the line. It's a constant effort and constant tension, but for those who won't settle for anything less than revolution - that sort of work, no matter how vital, just isn't compelling enough. I personally find the prevalence of this kind of attitude very disturbing, although I suppose it is just human nature in the end - perhaps with a bit of celebrity/hero worship thrown in.

Re: Ask HN: How can I do social good through programming?

#278

Post by Jemmeh »

cybermonkey wrote: post #51

We, as species, are invasive parasites. If you want to do some good for the future of the human kind, environment and this planet, invest your time in research about reducing human population by at least 2/3 without compromising future scientific discoveries and advances.

Sexual education, especially about birth control. Make birth control affordable. Make adoption mainstream/ preferred to having your own kids.

I agree that we have an overpopulation issue, we don't have the resources to support this many people currently. But calling people parasites is probably getting you downvoted.

Re: Ask HN: How can I do social good through programming?

#279

Post by Mz »

sheraz wrote: post #165
hooverlunch wrote: post #162

Join or start a tech worker co-op! First, one of the best ways to do social good is to fight capitalism. Just by working at a worker co-op, you're doing this. Many tech co-ops are also built around resisting other oppressions like racism, patriarchy, etc. Second, many co-ops (e.g. http://sassafras.coop , the one I work for) work on lots of social good projects.

Yes, evil capitalism. You know, don't want to think you actually think that. Perhaps you meant, "fight the negative outcomes sometimes found in capitalist societies."

Lots of people completely take the material blessings of capitalism for granted and totally believe capitalism is evil. It rarely dawns on them that their high quality of life and the luxury to fret about things like social good (instead of survival) is a direct result of so called capitalism.

Re: Ask HN: How can I do social good through programming?

#280

Post by iagooar »

rojobuffalo wrote: post #215

I think the most basic and overlooked thing is food. Eating well, reducing waste, and sustainable production are areas with huge opportunities. Energy and food are fundamental for improving quality of life; and they're also the human activities with the largest negative externalities to nature.

Totally agree. This is a field I'd like to explore and see where I can help improving it.

Also, everything that has to do with food is tangible and understandable by every single person in this world.

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