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Sweden drops Julian Assange rape investigation

bbc.co.uk

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Re: Sweden drops Julian Assange rape investigation

#221

Post by jacquesm »

notahacker wrote: post #163
jacquesm wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If the state wanted to railroad Assange, he'd have been in jail a lot quicker on much more straightforward charges Such as?

Aside from obscure statutes to do with privacy, computer misuse etc he may or may not (probably not) have been actually guilty of under Swedish law, I'd have thought anti-terrorism legislation (fewer legal safeguards, more reason to seize Wikileaks' digital assets) would have provided the perfect opportunity to put him out of action, as well as being the basis for all these renditions Assange-supporters keep referrin…

You'd still have to extradite. I don't see that happening in those cases, for one the EU in general (even the UK, or at least that was the situation in the past, May is an unknown quantity in this respect) has a dim view of the 'war on terror' as it is perpetrated by the US, for another the UK is pretty good when it comes to being consistent in their application of the law. More so than Sweden in any case.

Re: Sweden drops Julian Assange rape investigation

#222

Post by nailer »

efraim wrote: post #141
belorn wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That question was tested by the Swedish court, and they found that the prosecutor was able to continue the investigation by questioning Assange in the embassy through an agreement between the Ecuador and Sweden. This decision to drop the case was partial because of the result of that interview.

That interview was led by a prosecutor from Ecuador. The Swedish prosecutor and police was only allowed to be present, so they could not question Assange as they wanted.

Edited:

You're right. The Swedish prosecutor and police were present but indeed the questions were posed on their behalf.

> On Monday morning, a Swedish deputy chief prosecutor, Ingrid Isgren, and a police inspector, Cecilia Redell, arrived at the Ecuadorean Embassy, in the Knightsbridge section of West London, as journalists gathered outside.

I don't think this means that Sweden didn't get the chance to ask question though - and if there were any they were prevented from asking, I'm sure they would have stated this in the aftermath.

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/15/world/europe/assange-wiki...

Re: Sweden drops Julian Assange rape investigation

#223

Post by jacquesm »

Tomte wrote: post #148
jacquesm wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, that's not how it works. Showing up for a trial (and being represented) reduces your chances of a conviction. Sweden could have held a trial in absentia leading to a conviction if they believed they had a case to begin with. I always wondered why they did not do that.

As it has been explained many times: no, they couldn't have. Trial in absentia is not a universal feature of justice systems. Germany, for example, doesn't have it. Neither has Sweden.

In fact, it does. I don't know why people keep perpetrating these long ago debunked falsehoods.

Re: Sweden drops Julian Assange rape investigation

#224

Post by throw2016 »

Kiro wrote: post #218
throw2016 wrote: post #215

The hypocrisy is stunning. Chinese or Russian governments harassing whistle blowers and leakers on this scale would be met by a frenzy of hysterical global condemnation by the media, human rights orgs, governments and citizens with their domestic courts systems summarily dismissed and pay a price in global reputation and even sanctions. Yet here we have Snowden and Assange being harassed brazenly for years with littl…

> How have Swedish and UK citizens, [...] helped Snowden or Assange in any meaningful way in all these years? Well, since I believe he's guilty of rape I have no interest in helping him.

Since even the lady in question has not accused him of rape I wonder where your belief emanates from?

You just can't believe someone is guilty, there has to be due process to decide guilt and the court itself has dropped charges. So there is no basis for your beliefs.

Dissidents have traditionally faced trumped up charges. It's predictable that Assange would too. When charging dissidents the evidence and process has to be extraordinary and beyond reproach. But there are too many issues with the case and it makes the Swedish justice system look corrupt.

Re: Sweden drops Julian Assange rape investigation

#225

Post by k__ »

iddqd wrote: post #193
k__ wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Didn't they setup fake accusations to destroy his reputation and make it easier to let the US imprison him? I thought this all was pretty obvious :/

The rape victim is still holding on to these "fake" accusations even after 7 years. Strange eh?

Not really.

I mean, when you get in so deep, you can't just back off anymore.

Also, the background isn't know.

Those victims could be agents or be threatened by some governments.

Re: Sweden drops Julian Assange rape investigation

#226

Post by nebabyte »

sschueller wrote: post #30
Sephr wrote: post #14

What about the secret US charges? I honestly don't understand how in our democracy there is even such a concept as "secret charges". It just sounds mind-bogglingly corrupt and out of place.

There is a "kill list" [1] which is unbelievable on its own so I don't see this as much of a stretch. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disposition_Matrix

> U.S. officials speaking to The Washington Post seemed "confident that they have devised an approach that is so bureaucratically, legally and morally sound that future administrations will follow suit"

Wonder how much sleep Obama's been getting these days.

Re: Sweden drops Julian Assange rape investigation

#227

Post by Kiro »

throw2016 wrote: post #224
Kiro wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> How have Swedish and UK citizens, [...] helped Snowden or Assange in any meaningful way in all these years? Well, since I believe he's guilty of rape I have no interest in helping him.

Since even the lady in question has not accused him of rape I wonder where your belief emanates from? You just can't believe someone is guilty, there has to be due process to decide guilt and the court itself has dropped charges. So there is no basis for your beliefs. Dissidents have traditionally faced trumped up charges. It's predictable that Assange would too. When charging dissidents the evidence and process has…

> The plaintiff in the rape case was "shocked" by the decision, her lawyer said, and maintained her accusations against Mr Assange, Agence France-Presse reported.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/39973864

Re: Sweden drops Julian Assange rape investigation

#228

Post by empath75 »

mcv wrote: post #175
dalbasal wrote: post #118

I suppose the ball is now in the US' court . Assange is a strange case, hes (Wikileaks is) really a journalist, and should be protected by laws and conventions protecting journalists. But he doesn't seem to identify too strongly with the press and presents more like a political dissident. I used to live in Melbourne (where wikileaks is sort of based). I stopped to sign a petition in his support. The petition mentione…

When he still was just a journalist receiving and disseminating leaked information, I supported him. But after the Manning leaks, his power seems to have gone to his head, and he thought he could get away with anything. Journalists need to be protected from persecution for their work as journalism, but they don't get a free license to violate laws in completely unrelated cases. Rape is still rape. And his recent gran…

Actually, I think it wasn't the manning papers, it was being locked up in the Ecuadorian embassy, where the Russians were free to compromise him.

Re: Sweden drops Julian Assange rape investigation

#229

Post by ptaipale »

beilabs wrote: post #5

I wonder if the UK taxpayer will be asking some questions about the justifications of policing the embassy? A pretty abysmal ROI. So, will the police presence now simply disappear?

It's not about Assange. It's about rule of law.

If they'd allow Assange to skip bail without effectively trying to detain him, they would create a precedent for others.

In a system with rule of law, you can't make up different decisions, on the go, for people you happen to like or happen to dislike.

Likely the police presence will not disappear, it might actually be intensified for a moment. He's now not wanted for extradition to Sweden; he's wanted for skipping bail.

Re: Sweden drops Julian Assange rape investigation

#230

Post by dahart »

arethuza wrote: post #140
joshschreuder wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"If"?

I think the relevant part of the page being "Developed by the Obama administration beginning in 2010"

I'm not sure why that's the relevant part, but the part of the Obama administration responsible was CIA director Brennan, who was doing similar stuff during the G.W. Bush administration and just happened to give it an official name while Obama was around.

It's nowhere near the first kill list the US has had, it's just the first one called "Disposition Matrix". Previous administrations had other names. For example: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_actions_of_the_CIA

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