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Swift is like Kotlin

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Re: Swift is like Kotlin

#121

Post by Tanegashima »

coldtea wrote: post #102
NathanFlurry wrote: post #62

One has structures, ARC, proper extensions, good protocols/interfaces, flexible enums, and runs natively. The other one doesn't. I think I'll choose the former.

One has a top-notch IDE from a top-notch IDE vendor. The other has XCode. Also, ARC aside, for the 3-4 items you mentioned, either Kotlin also also has them, or has just as good alternatives. And none of those are life-changing. ARC vs a good GC is just a different tradeoff (no cycle detection vs pauses, etc). I'm sure you can find some things where Swift is better at, and others where Kotlin is. But not that many to…

Sure thing...

When will Jetbrain have a decent interface builder?

Decent instrumentation?

Decent documentation viewer?

Can you get an object graph with JetBrains?

Xcode isn't perfect, but it's way better than JetBrains.

Just because one has one feature that one doesn't have, doesn't mean that Xcode beats JetBrain's IDE all day.

Re: Swift is like Kotlin

#122

Post by Tanegashima »

AJRF wrote: post #113
dcgoss wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So does Swift ( https://developer.apple.com/swift/blog/?id=18 ) ( https://repl.it/site/blog/swift )

You've missed the point. He is saying that to get a hello world going in Kotlin you don't need to write a func if you are in the context of the REPL.

So does Swift

Re: Swift is like Kotlin

#123

Post by Retra »

coldtea wrote: post #111
brazzledazzle wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's so pretty but that's really disappointing. That puts a damper on even trying it but to be fair it could be a lot worse.

> That puts a damper on even trying it Hyperbole much?

Opinionated, I suspect, but not hyperbole.

Re: Swift is like Kotlin

#124

Post by notgood »

kozak wrote: post #71

Here in Ukraine it would be very hard to get adoption of a programming language that is named after a Russian military base. This is the rare case where bad naming choice really hurts. No matter how good is the language, you will have to hear and pronounce that name many times a day, and even associate yourself with it (e.g. "a Kotlin developer" in your resume). Not something to be taken lightly.

Exactly, how will this language triumph without the important support of Ukrainian developers? The 0.64% of all developers!

Re: Swift is like Kotlin

#125

Post by doubt_it_throw »

coldtea wrote: post #104
kozak wrote: post #71

Here in Ukraine it would be very hard to get adoption of a programming language that is named after a Russian military base. This is the rare case where bad naming choice really hurts. No matter how good is the language, you will have to hear and pronounce that name many times a day, and even associate yourself with it (e.g. "a Kotlin developer" in your resume). Not something to be taken lightly.

> Here in Ukraine it would be very hard to get adoption of a programming language that is named after a Russian military base. Well, except if you are an Ukrainian of Russian descent and root for the (ex)home team...

Russian descent appears not to be a necessary condition for a Ukrainian to "root for the home team". (Neither is it sufficient. But it does correlate.)

Re: Swift is like Kotlin

#126

Post by _pmf_ »

cel1ne wrote: post #114

* A feature I like about kotlin are the receivers, with which you can write type-safe builders: https://kotlinlang.org/docs/reference/type-safe-builders.htm... * Multiple receivers are possible enabling extension methods like this: class EnglishToGermanDictionary { val translations = mapOf ( "dog" to "Hund" ) /* extension method for string in the context of dictionary */ val String.inGerman get() = translations[this@…

The receivers mechanism is kind of nice; reminds me of this[0], except that in Kotlin, everything is still statically typed. It's a really clean way to implement Trygve Reenskaug's DCI architecture.

[0] http://www.p-cos.net/documents/contextl-soa.pdf (there was once an article called "ContextL : The Holy Grail of Business App Development", but this seems to be no longer available

Re: Swift is like Kotlin

#127

Post by markcerqueira »

NathanFlurry wrote: post #62

One has structures, ARC, proper extensions, good protocols/interfaces, flexible enums, and runs natively. The other one doesn't. I think I'll choose the former.

I've done both iOS and Android and I'll take Java + Kotlin + Android Studio over the iOS stack any day.

Re: Swift is like Kotlin

#129

Post by barbs »

NathanFlurry wrote: post #62

One has structures, ARC, proper extensions, good protocols/interfaces, flexible enums, and runs natively. The other one doesn't. I think I'll choose the former.

They're not really in direct competition. Try writing an Android app in Swift, or an iOS app in Kotlin. Technically possibly either way, but one's definitely more suited than the other for each purpose.

Re: Swift is like Kotlin

#130

Post by coldtea »

Retra wrote: post #123
coldtea wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That puts a damper on even trying it Hyperbole much?

Opinionated, I suspect, but not hyperbole.

There is such a thing as a hyperbolic opinion or reaction.

Not trying a language because one dislikes the syntax for one of 2000 features it has, and not even the most important one, looks hyperbolic to me.

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