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Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

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Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#161

Post by a_imho »

kbart wrote: post #144
dandare wrote: post #88

Why can't Microsoft or NSA or whatever good samaritan use the same vulnerability and attack vector to force-spread the update or at least a patch of some kind?

Because accessing and modifying computer systems without owner's prior agreement is a crime in most parts of the world. Why would MS, NSA or any other entity would risk potential trials?

prior agreement

I would be surprised if there wasn't at least a couple of paragraphs in the eula where people give much more control over to Microsoft.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#162

Post by dandare »

kbart wrote: post #159
dandare wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did MS not force upgrade users to Win10 against their will - which caused many of them to switch off autoupdate in the first place?

I'm sure automated updates were covered in EULA. Not that I agree with this MS step though (see my other comment in this thread).

You are probably right.

In that case could not the president issue an executive order asking NSA to use the hack to protect everyone?

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#163

Post by vocatus_gate »

ZoFreX wrote: post #148
bigbugbag wrote: post #84

Does this guy work for microsoft ? It reads like a partisant piece for microsoft. Totally overlooked the suspicious timeline of Microsoft releasing patched for vulnerabilities that were exploited for a long time by the NSA right after it was made apparent those had been stolen and were about to be released in the wild. No question asked about NSA having known and exploited those vulnerabilities for a while, no questi…

> No mention that disabling Microsoft update trend is a logical answer No, it isn't. Disabling update isn't a logical answer to _anything_ except "what's the best way to get malware". If you don't want Microsoft's "spyware" don't install their OS. There is no coherent logic to simultaneously not trusting Microsoft, and running their code - any version of it.

No. In THEORY you're more vulnerable to exploits in the wild by disabling Windows Update. In REALITY you're statistically FAR more likely to be harassed and have your software/apps/OS break due to Microsoft's "very similar to malware-style" forced updates.

I disabled Win10 updates over 1.5 years ago with zero issue. Security people love to claim the sky is falling, but it's all about risk/reward. Risk of issue due to actual exploit is pretty low for most people, so even though the potential IMPACT is very high, because the probability is so low compared to the constant irritation of Microsoft arbitrarily forcing whatever they want down your throat once a month, they just deal with it and shut off updates.

edit: downvote if you want, I'm not wrong.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#164

Post by setq »

UK-AL wrote: post #157
cartoonfoxes wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have no idea why this scenario gets talked about so little. It is an edge case, but its a huge edge-case. There are entire ecosystems of Windows-only software where running batch operations overnight are a daily fact of life. I'm nearly resigned to the fact that I may have to segregate engineering workstations to their own network and whitelist their traffic. IsActiveHoursEnabled is ignored.

I would assume the large majority of windows users doing batch stuff over night are businesses. At that point you should probably be using windows server + wsus. Which give you a lot more control over updates.

I agree with the person above your comment. For example some simulation loads are common to run on deskside systems.

However this IS definitely an edge case and it is possible to turn it off. I have run a physical host as a build agent that has uptime of months on Windows 10.

This is administrative competence, not a problem with the product or the use case.

WSUS + Windows server is definitely fine for most workloads though.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#165

Post by JorgeGT »

rhodysurf wrote: post #95
kristianc wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article points out that you can set hours when Windows will update.

This still isnt always useful. I work in an office that creates and runs CFD software. It often takes days, or weeks to run and the recent windows "feature" of rebooting when it wants to update with no way to shut it off has killed so many peoples work in progress. Its insane there is no ability to only update manually.

If your CFD software isn't saving at least the last converged timestep in order to restart the calculation if there's an unplanned interrupt maybe you should implement such a feature! It's been a lifesaver for me many times.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#166

Post by vocatus_gate »

gens wrote: post #76

I wish I could disable updates. Dumb ass win10 thinks it's ok to download 2 GIGABYTES of data. How is it reasonable to have gigabytes of updates ? For security ? I have gigabytes of binaries here ? And then 15 days later, 1.5GB of updates. (note: my win10 laptop is usually used with mobile internet) Win10 is a shame. They could have at least separated security updates from random crap updates. A button would be nice…

Unlike all these Stockholm-syndrome affected users here, I will tell you.

Start --> 'services.msc' --> find "Windows Updates" service --> right-click --> properties --> switch it to Disabled and reboot.

Turn it on once a month or whenever YOU want to update. Done.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#167

Post by Silhouette »

masklinn wrote: post #105
rhodysurf wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This still isnt always useful. I work in an office that creates and runs CFD software. It often takes days, or weeks to run and the recent windows "feature" of rebooting when it wants to update with no way to shut it off has killed so many peoples work in progress. Its insane there is no ability to only update manually.

> Its insane there is no ability to only update manually. There is.

An officially supported channel that will let you select important security updates to install if and when you want to and not push anything else? Without relying on enterprise management features and the like? That would be interesting news to a lot of people, I'm sure, so please share what you know.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#168

Post by cesarb »

moonshinefe wrote: post #121
Grue3 wrote: post #83

I'm currently on Windows 7 and don't want to accidentally install Windows 10. Turning off updates seems to be the only reliable way to do this.

The window for the free 7 -> 10 update is long gone, turn your updates back on and install security updates until they run out in 2020.

It's a question of trust. That user no longer trusts WU to not silently install Windows 10. The window might have closed, but who says it won't open again suddenly, or a WU bug won't make it think it's still inside the window?

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#169

Post by kbart »

dandare wrote: post #162
kbart wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sure automated updates were covered in EULA. Not that I agree with this MS step though (see my other comment in this thread).

You are probably right. In that case could not the president issue an executive order asking NSA to use the hack to protect everyone?

NSA doesn't have legal power outside USA. That still would be illegal hacking with potential political and/or legal backlash. I understand what you mean, but that's grey area at best.

Re: Don't tell people to turn off Windows Update

#170

Post by ams6110 »

oneeyedpigeon wrote: post #137
chrischen wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

MacOS handles this perfectly. It clearly notifies you when an update will be installed if you restart.

It also gives you the option of re-trying the update "tonight" which takes up WAY too much of my cognitive load. "Tonight" doesn't appear to be configurable, or even well-defined, although an obscure knowledge-base article tells me it's between "2:00 and 5:00 a.m", which is nothing like my expectation of what "tonight" means. Does that run if my laptop is sleeping? What about if it needs to reboot? I really should kn…

Pretty sure that "tonight" just dismisses the prompt until "tonight" at which point you'll see it again, it doesn't irrevocably schedule the update for "tonight."
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