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A federal court has denied a pre-trial motion to dismiss a GPL enforcement case

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Re: A federal court has denied a pre-trial motion to dismiss a GPL enforcement case

#131
post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about the disclaimer of warranty and limitation of liability?

Disclaimer and limitation of liability is a very old legal aspect about trade law which from a US perspective historically originate from UK law before the time of colonization. It has nothing to do with copyright or technology. As the story go, someone bought a mill shaft but the delivery was delayed and the customer sued the seller and wanted compensation for the delay. This in turn lead to a legal requirement to m…

OK, but so what? It still in some sense restricts the rights of the person using the software.

Re: A federal court has denied a pre-trial motion to dismiss a GPL enforcement case

#132
post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well obviously their contention is that you're buying a license to use the software and not the software itself. You're free to disagree but it's internally consistent.

They can disagree all they want, but it is on them to prove that I agreed to buy a license, when I am physically holding something I bought. I didn't have to sign a contract for it. Adding terms after the purchase makes it a post-purchase agreement and that is unenforceable in most western jurisdictions.

Somebody should inform all the companies selling enterprise software whose entire model depends on selling seats, then.

Re: A federal court has denied a pre-trial motion to dismiss a GPL enforcement case

#133
post #16

"Corley denied the motion, and in doing so, set the precedent that licenses like the GNU GPL can be treated like legal contracts, and developers can legitimately sue when those contracts are breached." The GNU GPL was written on the basis that if someone does not accept its terms, then that without any other license from the copyright holder, redistribution puts that person in violation of copyright law. Suing for da…

But if for some reason some court rules the GPL invalid, doesn't it mean that the companies using the GPL'ed software are violating copyright?

Because the GPL license is the only thing granting them the rights to use that intellectual property, right?

Re: A federal court has denied a pre-trial motion to dismiss a GPL enforcement case

#134
post #129
post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Question: Is that what Stallman intended to accomplish with the GPL? Pay a fee for GPL source code and bypass the GPL? (I apologize for my ignorance here.) It seems like "reciprocity" has an even worse outcome than BSD source code. The origin of the source code can be completely hidden from the user. Do users deserve to know at least that the original source code was freely available ? What happens when users discove…

Forgive my ignorance too - but I don't think the intended goal of the GPL is to allow you to dual-license, I think Stallman would (I'm guessing) not want people to license code as anything other than GPL, so I imagine he'd discourage paying for non-GPLed code.

Not necessarily.

"I've considered selling exceptions acceptable since the 1990s, and on occasion I've suggested it to companies. Sometimes this approach has made it possible for important programs to become free software."

Read his full text for some boundaries he sees.

https://www.fsf.org/blogs/rms/selling-exceptions

Re: A federal court has denied a pre-trial motion to dismiss a GPL enforcement case

#135
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A license is a contract. I don't understand the artificial distinction between the two, specifically in reference to GNU GPL. http://www.technollama.co.uk/a-licence-or-a-contract

I like how correct comments like yours around here every time gpl comes up are downvoted to oblivion. shows there's load work to do from the eff to educate people at wtf gpl is

there's load work to do from the eff

FSF

Re: A federal court has denied a pre-trial motion to dismiss a GPL enforcement case

#137
post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> ...which otherwise you don't have. Why not? If I own a chair, I have the right to use it. If I own a copy of the software (that I paid for in a store, for example), then there is nothing in law that says that I cannot use it. I have rights over what I own. Nothing restricts that. Copyright law exists to protect software writers by providing them with a means to make money making software. This law restricts my abil…

Well obviously their contention is that you're buying a license to use the software and not the software itself. You're free to disagree but it's internally consistent.

That may be their contention, but this is exactly why this is fundamentally different to the copyleft case. The GPL requires none of this.

I would add that it seems pretty specious to argue that I bought a license when the license was not presented to me at the time I paid for the product and left the store, but I accept that this could be their contention.

Re: A federal court has denied a pre-trial motion to dismiss a GPL enforcement case

#138
post #133
post #16

"Corley denied the motion, and in doing so, set the precedent that licenses like the GNU GPL can be treated like legal contracts, and developers can legitimately sue when those contracts are breached." The GNU GPL was written on the basis that if someone does not accept its terms, then that without any other license from the copyright holder, redistribution puts that person in violation of copyright law. Suing for da…

But if for some reason some court rules the GPL invalid, doesn't it mean that the companies using the GPL'ed software are violating copyright? Because the GPL license is the only thing granting them the rights to use that intellectual property, right?

The court could rule that part of the license is invalid, but not all of it.

Re: A federal court has denied a pre-trial motion to dismiss a GPL enforcement case

#139
post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Disclaimer and limitation of liability is a very old legal aspect about trade law which from a US perspective historically originate from UK law before the time of colonization. It has nothing to do with copyright or technology. As the story go, someone bought a mill shaft but the delivery was delayed and the customer sued the seller and wanted compensation for the delay. This in turn lead to a legal requirement to m…

OK, but so what? It still in some sense restricts the rights of the person using the software.

In what sense? You can still use the software, you just can't expect its use to yield a particular result and sue the programmer if it doesn't live up to that expectation.

Re: A federal court has denied a pre-trial motion to dismiss a GPL enforcement case

#140
The article somewhat overstates the significance of this case in terms of precedential value.

On a procedural level, understand that this is a district court opinion and is not binding on any other court. Of course, if other courts find the arguments persuasive, they can adopt the reasoning. But no court has to adopt the reasoning in this opinion.

On a substantive level, it's important to look at the arguments the court is addressing and how they are addressed:

1) Did the plaintiff adequately allege a breach of contract claim?

We're at the motion to dismiss phase here and the court is only looking at plaintiff's complaint and accepting all of the allegations as true.

There are essentially only 2 arguments the court addresses: A) Was there a contract here at all?; and B) Did the plaintiff adequately allege a recognizable harm?

Understand that in a complaint for breach of contract, a plaintiff has to allege certain things: (i) the existence of a contract; (ii) plaintiff performed or was excused from performance; (iii) defendant's breach; (iv) damages. So, the court is addressing (i) and (iv), which I refer to as (A) and (B) above.

As to (A), the argument the defendant appears to have made is that an open source license is not enforceable because a lack of "mutual assent." In other words, like a EULA or shrink-wrap license, some argue that an by using software subject open source license doesn't demonstrate that you agreed to the terms of that license.

The court, without any real analysis, says that by alleging the existence of an open source license and using the source code, that is sufficient to allege the existence of a contract. The court cites as precedent that alleging the existence of a shrink-wrap license has been held as sufficient to allege the existence of a contract.

But the key word here is "allege." As the case proceeds, the defendant is free to develop evidence to show that there was no agreement between the parties as to the terms of a license. So, very little definitive was actually decided at this stage. All that was decided is that alleging that an open source license existed is not legally deficient per se to allege the existence of a contract.

As to (B), defendant apparently argued that plaintiff suffered no recognizable harm from defendant's actions. The court held that defendant deprived plaintiff of commercial license fees.

In addition, and more important for the audience here, the court held that there is a recognizable harm based on defendant's failure to comply with the open source requirements of the GPL license. Basically, the court says that there are recognizable benefits (including economic benefits) that come from the creation and distribution of public source code, wholly apart from license fees.

This is key - if the plaintiff did not have a paid commercial licensing program, it could STILL sue for breach of contract because of this second type of harm.

That being said, none of this argument is new. There is established precedent on this point.

2) Is the breach of contract claim preempted?

Copyright law in the United States is federal law. Breach of contract is state law. A plaintiff cannot use a state law claim to enforce rights duplicative of those protected by federal copyright law.

So, what the court is looking at here, is whether there is some extra right that the breach of contract claim addresses that is not provided under copyright law.

In other words, if the only thing that the breach of contract claim was addressing the right to publish or create derivative works, then it would be duplicative of the copyright claim. And, therefore, it would be preempted.

Here, the court held that there are two rights that the breach of contract claim addresses that are different from what copyright law protects: (A) the requirement to open source; and (B) compensation for "extraterritorial" infringement.

The real key here is (A), not (B). With respect to (A), the court here is saying that the GNU GPL's copyleft provisions that defendant allegedly breached are an extra right that is being enforced through the breach of contract claim that are not protected under copyright law. Therefore, the contract claim is not preempted.

(B) is a bit less significant for broader application. What (B) is saying is that because the plaintiff is suing for defendant's infringement outside the U.S. ("extraterritorial" infringement), and federal copyright law doesn't necessarily address such infringement, that's an "extra element" of the breach of contract claim. I say this is less significant because it wouldn't apply to a defendant who didn't infringe outside the United States. So, if you were the plaintiff here and the defendant was in California and only distributed the software in the U.S., argument (B) wouldn't apply.

I hope this clarifies what is/is not significant about the opinion here.

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