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Solar Roof

tesla.com

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Re: Solar Roof

#441

Post by mundo »

SwellJoe wrote: post #439
mundo wrote: post #426

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I applaud you for trying to think through this stuff, but minus all the ranting it sounds like what you're basically saying is that there are a bunch of ways we could be (but aren't) spending government money to reduce energy use while also helping poor people. How confident are you of this? Can you name a couple? For example, are you aware that most states already offer subsidies for buying more efficient appliances…

I readily admit I am not a policy wonk (though I follow environmental issues more closely than most). I am aware of green home initiatives at various levels of government (I've owned a home in the past, and have taken advantage of some of those). Again, I'm not opposed to the subsidies and tax credits that incentivize power reduction. > Characterizing the current policy as "let's give wealthy people more money to pla…

I get where you're coming from, I just don't think it's very relevant to solar power or energy subsidies. The rich were getting richer and the poor were getting screwed a long time before solar power was invented; I don't see how these subsidies are any better or worse an example than anything else. It feels like your issue is more emotional than anything else (hence why you keep saying "rewarded", as if homeowners buying solar panels weren't spending their own money on something that benefits their community). As in, it feels distasteful to spend money on something that benefits the rich, when you're hyper-aware of the plight of the poor. That's understandable, but it's a terrible way to think about a policy like this, because we spend about $4B/year on solar subsidies, which is enough to make a noticeable difference in solar installations but nowhere near big enough to affect income inequality.

Believe me, I'm all in favor of "Take money from rich people and give it to poor people". Which we already do, in a variety of ways! I just think we ought to be able to talk about specific policies like "Should we spend money on getting more solar power?" separately from that. You think climate change is an urgent problem? I agree, which is why the objection you're raising here seems like quibbling. If an asteroid were hurtling towards the Earth, and someone proposed that we build a rocket to fly a ragtag group of oilrig workers led by Bruce Willis to blow it up and save the world, would you stand up in that meeting and say, "Yeah, I guess that would work, but I'm concerned that it might exacerbate income inequality"?

Re: Solar Roof

#442

Post by omegaworks »

gremlinsinc wrote: post #340
omegaworks wrote: post #336

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why does there need to be "the best" preschool. Can't we have a society with standards? A society that gives a damn about iniquity?

I think you mean inequality...iniquity is sin...which society doesn't care much about either lol

It all falls down.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BswphxnAibE

Re: Solar Roof

#443

Post by nextlevelshit »

Has anybody information about the energy cost for production of one tile and the time it takes to generate this energy by the solar cell.

Just the fact that it is a solar roof doesn't mean it is environmentally friendly!

Re: Solar Roof

#444

Post by dx034 »

syncsynchalt wrote: post #204
drozycki wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not an expert here but a couple things come to mind. From an environmental perspective, it is better to use surface area which is already built up than pristine natural desert land. The house itself already imposes an ecological cost. A solar roof adds around zero to that cost. I've heard the stat thrown about that 50% of energy generated is lost to transmission. If that's true then there's efficiency to generation a…

Decentralized solar generation helps the grid in some ways but hurts it in others, specifically the need for sundown peak generation. See for example the "duck curve" problem that CAISO is facing: https://www.caiso.com/Documents/FlexibleResourcesHelpRenewab...

Only if you don't have batteries at home. Tesla promotes buying the roof with a battery pack which would allow you to use evening energy by battery and charge overnight (good for the grid) for the morning peak.

Re: Solar Roof

#445

Post by dx034 »

tomaskafka wrote: post #401
def- wrote: post #393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I couldn't quite believe your numbers, and couldn't find any confirmation for them: http://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/images/4/4... http://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php/...

Hm, that seems unusually high, really wonder where these stats come from. Is every eurostat statistic distorted like that? Here's a chart of energy prices on a Prague energy exchange, currently it's about 30 EUR/MWh = 0.032 USD/kWh. I pay a bit more than that (incl. distribution) with a good tarif (low cost broker), but even conservative people I know who don't renegotiate energy prices get about 0.06 USD/kWh incl. a…

Still seems low for retail. In Europe, the UK has very low costs with ~12-13€c/kwh, high cost countries such as Germany are more around 25-30c/kwh (taxes and renewable energy charge).

Re: Solar Roof

#446

Post by ianai »

angstrom wrote: post #376
ianai wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm thinking it's early adopters and new buildings. The Tesla roof on a newly built home may make more sense than a retrofit.

Right, noone is acknowledging SolarCity's pre-existing relationships with homebuilders. http://www.solarcity.com/commercial/homebuilders

It's going to be cheaper (marginally) to build something in at design than after.

Re: Solar Roof

#447

Post by kristinafoley »

The bigger problem with this is that they are being made at 2009 electrical code specifications, and we're at 2017. Will they really be available anywhere outside of California?

The calculator will not go over 50%. So then what? Still pay for their tiles for the whole roof?

And what if 4 in the middle of my roof are bad? Or 10? or 4 this week and 10 next week? How many times do I have to have them out?

What about ALL the wires? Where do those all go? Each tile will have wires needing to connect to an inverter and the Powerwall? Electricians are already in high demand, how long will I have to wait for them to do this? Electricians are EXPENSIVE, do I have to pay for each hour they are repairing this system??

Powerwalls have a 10 year warranty. There is no cost for replacement included in their 30 year projections.

Is anyone believing this administration will continue the tax credit, on solar??

Solar shingles have been done. Every company has already discontinued them. CGI works in advertising, but doesn't work in reality.

Re: Solar Roof

#448

Post by noneeeed »

mathgeek wrote: post #282
giarc wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think he was specifically referring to slate and/or clay roofs, not asphalt shingle roofs.

Like most similar comparisons, it's essentially "our cheapest X will be the same as the most expensive of Y."

From all the comments I've read, it really sounds like it's going to make more sense outside of the US. Here in the UK the vast majority of roofs are either clay tiles or slates which are expected to last 50 or more years, but the US seems to largely fit cheaper asphalt shingles and replace them more often.

At the moment our slate roof is fine, but when it needs replacing I'll certainly look into the Tesla tiles. Hopefully we'll be able to hold off for long enough that they will have come down in price. I'm sceptical that they will be worth it, but if they make sense then we would definitely think about it.

Re: Solar Roof

#449

Post by giarc »

noneeeed wrote: post #448
mathgeek wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like most similar comparisons, it's essentially "our cheapest X will be the same as the most expensive of Y."

From all the comments I've read, it really sounds like it's going to make more sense outside of the US. Here in the UK the vast majority of roofs are either clay tiles or slates which are expected to last 50 or more years, but the US seems to largely fit cheaper asphalt shingles and replace them more often. At the moment our slate roof is fine, but when it needs replacing I'll certainly look into the Tesla tiles. Hop…

As a Canadian, our common perception of the UK is that it's always cloudy and rainy. If that's true, would it make sense to put solar tiles on a home if the ROI is negative or would take a few hundred years?

Re: Solar Roof

#450

Post by pyoung »

pdabbadabba wrote: post #438
pyoung wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are using Google's Project Sunroof[1] to do the modeling. The tool uses satellite images of your roof to create the estimates, and accounts for orientation, shading from trees, etc... [1] https://www.google.com/get/sunroof

What makes you think that? I'm a little skeptical because Sunroof doesn't cover my address, but I have no problem getting an estimate.

They have a link to sunroof below their estimate. Not sure what happens if you aren't covered by sunroof, but their are a ton of solar estimation tools out there that will give you a rough idea of your potential just based on lat/lon.
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