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Solar Roof

tesla.com

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Re: Solar Roof

#391

Post by kristofferR »

jpatokal wrote: post #248
matt_wulfeck wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's true in a lot of places but not really in California, where there's a lot of customers for solar. I don't need to go into the reasons why. It's California.

Why so? California's climate is pretty optimal for solar generation and there's a lot of desert waiting to be covered in solar panels. Solar is not going to have a similar impact on (say) Ireland in the next 30 years.

More solar will likely result in higher grid energy prices, since people will buy a lot less energy while the grid costs the same to maintain.

Re: Solar Roof

#392

Post by kartickv »

IvanK_net wrote: post #45

I have always been a huge fan of a quick transition to sustainable energy sources. There is just one little thing I don't understand. Why they expect people to make electricity at their homes? You can buy a little piece of land in a dessert, put solar panels there and distribute the electricity to other places. And you don't have to climb on any roof during the installation or the maintenance. It is not profitable to…

If you stay in a hot area, you're also going to save money from lower AC bills, because the solar panels would absorb some of the heat that would otherwise enter your house.

Re: Solar Roof

#393

Post by def- »

tomaskafka wrote: post #389
tlb wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's the right question to ask. Home electricity costs around $0.15/kWh, while power plants sell electricity to the grid for around $0.03/kWh. The difference pays for installing and maintaining the grid and local distribution wires to your home. Depending where you are (I live in a forest, where a tree falls on the power lines a few times a year and they have to send out guys in a bucket truck to fix it) it's expensi…

My electric costs are 0.035 USD/kWh here in Europe (Czech Republic). Wth is wrong with the USA? It seems like you're getting screwed over everything. 10x electricity, 100x healthcare and education - is US market really just a bunch of colluding monopolies?

I couldn't quite believe your numbers, and couldn't find any confirmation for them: http://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/images/4/4...

http://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php/...

Re: Solar Roof

#394

Post by kartickv »

Would it be possible to decouple the roof from the solar? In other words, I'd buy this roof for the cost of a normal roof, and an investor would pay for the cost of the solar panels, and they'd own the electricity that comes from it. The panels would provide me a power backup (in the event of a power cut), for which I'd pay at the same rate as I pay the grid.

This would be helpful for houseowners who want to be green, or want backup in the event of a power cut (a regular event in India), but don't want to or can't invest so much in a roof. They get power backup without making an upfront investment.

Investors would benefit from getting a free site to install their panels on.

Re: Solar Roof

#395

Post by qwtel »

robotresearcher wrote: post #353
mholt wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not the point. Sales from their previous, more expensive models allowed them to ramp up production capacity for the Model 3.

Not even close. Enormous borrowing and investment raising allowed them to ramp up production capacity.

strange how they didnt do that right out of the gate... maybe nobody would lend and invest in a company with no history of building a car, let alone one that was deemed impossible? now lets put on our after the fact analysis hat, where cause and effect are blurred and previous uncertainties are already resolved and we can conclude whatever what we set out to conclude. and thats how we get from "this car cant be built" to "i could have done it".

Re: Solar Roof

#396

Post by crazy2be »

vkou wrote: post #332
sbov wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you done the math? If net metering didn't exist, my back-of-the-envelope calculations say it would probably break even in California. With net metering, sure, it's pointless.

My parents pay $1,200/year for electricity, in a fairly large house. Given the expected lifetime of a power wall, that will eat all the 'savings' of living off the grid. There's also the matter that if, say, 40% of the population disconnects itself from the grid, that doesn't mean that the cost of maintaining that infrastructure will drop by 60%. Someone will have to pay for it.

Where are you getting $15,000 for the powerwall? It's $5,500 for 13.5kWh, which should be enough for nighttime loads in many houses (but may require some inconveniences, like not running the dryer at night).

You are right that it does not yet work out, it's $0.17/kWh for the powerwall (assuming you fully charge/discharge it each night) + cost for panels. Given that grid-disconnected users would want some buffer, an off-grid system probably works out to ~$0.40/kWh all in for battery-stored electricity

You could save a big chunk of this by some habit changes, most of the cost comes from the batteries, so scheduling energy intensive activities to run during the day reduces your cost for them to $0.10/kWh or so.

Honestly I am surprised how close these numbers are. I initially was sure the grid would survive in cities, but now I am not so sure. In 10 years these numbers will likely be half what they are now (batteries in particular will be way cheaper). It might all be enough to kill the grid in many places.

Re: Solar Roof

#397

Post by [deleted] »

def- wrote: post #393
tomaskafka wrote: post #389

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My electric costs are 0.035 USD/kWh here in Europe (Czech Republic). Wth is wrong with the USA? It seems like you're getting screwed over everything. 10x electricity, 100x healthcare and education - is US market really just a bunch of colluding monopolies?

I couldn't quite believe your numbers, and couldn't find any confirmation for them: http://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/images/4/4... http://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php/...

[deleted]

Re: Solar Roof

#398

Post by marvin »

ghaff wrote: post #169
rhino369 wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think people overvalue the value of being off the grid. The average person isn't doing anything that critical at home, so they can just deal with it. Diesel generators work for people with critical use cases. Katrina is the only time in my lifetime where a major city / region was without power and without gas deliveries for a long time.

Where I live (Northeast), pretty much the only time where an extended power outage is a serious problem is in the winter. And that's because of losing heat. A Powerwall-like "UPS" that could handle some critical systems (basically my furnace) automatically is interesting. But any solar panels are likely to be under snow and ice. Pretty much the only thing that's really a problem for me in a power outage is losing hea…

I think Tesla alluded to building heating elements into the tiles to keep snow and ice from building up, but I am not sure whether this is making its way into the final product. (Also unsure how this would play out in a snowstorm well below freezing temperatures).

Re: Solar Roof

#399

Post by celticninja »

bionsuba wrote: post #374
toomuchtodo wrote: post #317

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Houses need roofs that last. Why put a new roof on every 15-20 years if you can put one on that lasts the lifetime of the house?

Because unless you go with a metal roof that's a pipe dream.

I live in a house built in the early 1900's with the original slate tile roof still on it and it's in decent shape.

Re: Solar Roof

#400

Post by asendra »

aplummer wrote: post #201
jaredhansen wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They've gotta be just trying to snipe rich early-adopter-for-the-status types. Tesla? The company that brought you the Roadster first, then the Model S and X, and only later the Model 3? I'm shocked. ;)

yeah i know aren't these the exact people that should pay for these kinds of things? I think it's a great model. Can't wait for the model 3 version!

All the rich people that bought the expensive Teslas have used up almost all of the tax credits so the majority of model 3 buyers will be SOL
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