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CockroachDB 1.0

cockroachlabs.com

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Re: CockroachDB 1.0

#221

Post by sandstrom »

SilasX wrote: post #168
newsat13 wrote: post #160

Very disappointed with HN turning into a 4chan/reddit style trolling board about the name. Guys, we get it that you don't like the name. Can we please stop bike shedding and move on? The people at cockroachdb have obviously seen all your messages but decided it's worth keeping the name. What more is there to talk about? Why not talk about the relative technical merits of this DB?

It's not bikeshedding when the bikeshed's color will actually have concrete effects on adoption. Most people -- i.e. in procurement, management, finance, and others you need to appeal to -- don't want anything to do with cockroaches. The idea disgusts them at a gut level, not something you can talk away. HN users are giving vital advice, for free. Those who ignore it will have only themselves to blame. As I say every…

Mongo (similar to 'mongolism', another term for Down's syndrome) has done just fine, despite (or thanks to!) their name.

There was similar criticism about their name in the early days, but it has waned as mongo has grown. This will too.

Re: CockroachDB 1.0

#222

Post by sandstrom »

I think it's an excellent name!

Also, biologists would argue that cockroaches is a magnificent creature, highly adaptable and very fit (in 'survival of the fittest' terms).

I would pay for and deploy a cockroach db — because of its name.

Re: CockroachDB 1.0

#223

Post by [deleted] »

throwasehasdwi wrote: post #187
newsat13 wrote: post #160

Very disappointed with HN turning into a 4chan/reddit style trolling board about the name. Guys, we get it that you don't like the name. Can we please stop bike shedding and move on? The people at cockroachdb have obviously seen all your messages but decided it's worth keeping the name. What more is there to talk about? Why not talk about the relative technical merits of this DB?

It's not trolling. It's a legitimate warning and they can choose to ignore the chorus to their own peril. The warnings get louder as they get more resistant to changing their name. Keeping the name for whatever reason IS going to cost them enterprise customers

[deleted]

Re: CockroachDB 1.0

#224

Post by rubyn00bie »

mburst wrote: post #219
rubyn00bie wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to be an ass but... It so far appears not to be hurting them. In the slightest. This "warning" comes from the HN crowd every time something is posted about CockroachDB. I think it's time to LET IT GO. I for one, completely disagree with you but that's because I have a different understanding of the relationship between the business side and engineering. We are already looked at as eccentric and strange people, ra…

> It so far appears not to be hurting them. In the slightest. I feel like that is tough to judge because the public has only known them by one name as far as I know. If they switched to this name from another name and saw no difference then we could surmise that the name has had no affect.

I disagree that it's tough to judge but that's because they've raised a considerable amount of capital ($53 million over three rounds):

https://www.crunchbase.com/organization/cockroach-labs#/enti...

Re: CockroachDB 1.0

#225

Post by disconnected »

rgacote wrote: post #177
newsat13 wrote: post #160

Very disappointed with HN turning into a 4chan/reddit style trolling board about the name. Guys, we get it that you don't like the name. Can we please stop bike shedding and move on? The people at cockroachdb have obviously seen all your messages but decided it's worth keeping the name. What more is there to talk about? Why not talk about the relative technical merits of this DB?

Much better to name it something like Oracle, after a mythical seer who gives cryptic, self-contradictory answers open to wild interpretation.

Well, since this discussion has already gone down the tubes, we might as well spend some productive time making fun of other DB names:

- SQLite: SQL database with no sugar. Less calories!

- MySQL: A selfish database.

- IMB DB2: Released in 1983, but never got promoted to DB3. Probably abandoned software?

- Postgresql: Gesundheit!

- CouchDB: A database for lazy people. Part of the NOSQL family, the Zen database family, that achieve SQL by not achieving SQL... like I said, lazy.

- Microsoft Access: It's very accessible. Ironically, most people that use Office don't know what it is, or that it exists, and thus, don't use it.

- dBase: De-bases your data.

- Sybase: Pronounced sigh base, which is the sound people make when you suggest it.

Re: CockroachDB 1.0

#226

Post by sillysaurus3 »

efsavage wrote: post #142
anthonylebrun wrote: post #56

Since there's a little side riff about the name going on I thought I'd throw in my 2 cents. Personally I love the name. I think it does a great job of conveying the spirit of the project and provides unlimited pun opportunities. Plus it's memorable, just like a real life roach encounter. Unfortunately I'm sure some people will discriminate against your DB on the basis of name alone. That's ludicrous, but that's our s…

It's a bad name because this topic will come up every time it's discussed, forever. It's a distraction from other relevant issues like new features or how it performs.

Strangely, it seems to be helping them. Usually whenever there's an excellent product/article featured on HN, there's not much to say, so there are very few comments. CockroachDB seems like an excellent product, yet the firestorm about their name is fueling discussion, which amusingly might be leading to more upvotes from people who dislike that they're being discriminated against based on their name. It's counterintuitive internet behavior at its finest, similar to everyone complaining that Soylent was a terrible name.

Re: CockroachDB 1.0

#227

Post by nickpsecurity »

benesch wrote: post #53
zzzcpan wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are targeting MySQL/Postgres users, basically a post-CAP approach to RDBMS. But if you can work with eventual consistency, they are definitely not your first choice.

[Cockroach Labs engineer here.] Yes, if very low-latency (i.e., P99 latency sub-5ms) reads and writes are critical to your application, CockroachDB should not be your first choice. That said, one of the primary motivations for CockroachDB is that most existing systems don't handle eventual consistency well. In our experience, most developers will eventually write code that assumes a consistent database, either accide…

I support the default on consistence the way you posed it. Main reason is safe-by-default construction has proven more effective for average programmer over decades. The other approach caused many disasters.

Re: CockroachDB 1.0

#228

Post by yellowapple »

newsat13 wrote: post #160

Very disappointed with HN turning into a 4chan/reddit style trolling board about the name. Guys, we get it that you don't like the name. Can we please stop bike shedding and move on? The people at cockroachdb have obviously seen all your messages but decided it's worth keeping the name. What more is there to talk about? Why not talk about the relative technical merits of this DB?

What's even wrong with the name anyway? It's certainly a lot better than the ridiculous ones like "PostgreSQL" and "MongoDB" and "Redis" (what do these words even mean?).

Re: CockroachDB 1.0

#229

Post by apognu »

I've been following CockroachDB for quite a while. Great job on 1.0.

I've had a question for quite some time though (and I think there is an RFC for it on GitHub): do we still need to have a "seed node" that is run without the --join parameter, or can we run all the nodes with the same command line, with the cluster waiting for quorum to reconcile on its own?

Re: CockroachDB 1.0

#230

Post by iamNumber4 »

thraway2016 wrote: post #169
SilasX wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not bikeshedding when the bikeshed's color will actually have concrete effects on adoption. Most people -- i.e. in procurement, management, finance, and others you need to appeal to -- don't want anything to do with cockroaches. The idea disgusts them at a gut level, not something you can talk away. HN users are giving vital advice, for free. Those who ignore it will have only themselves to blame. As I say every…

procurement, management, finance, and others you need to appeal to They don't need to appeal to any of these suits. Just the technical decision-makers, whose express job it is to choose solutions on their technical merits, not their spurious emotional reactions.

There is a sad fact though is that there are many organizations do not have technical people at the decision making level.

So these Suits you speak of, won't be able to get past the product name, enough to hear any technical merits of why this technology should ever be considered. Due to disfunctional leadership not even having a role of Chief Technical officer, or Chief Informational officer at the senior leadership level. A lot outsource because they don't want to hire/pay for this in house. It also shifts responsibility away, giving the CEO,COO,CFO, etc... the ability to point fingers at an outside entity.

That is a double whammy! internal can't sell/justify it to management, and outside IT providers/contractors can't sell it either.

So while they may be surviving with the current name they have, that does not mean they wouldn't be crushing the market share with a different name. If they are getting negative comments about the product name, then that's a warning that they should do market research to find out how many people would avoid the product because of the name.

But what the hell do I know, I'm making yet another HN comment post.

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