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Ask HN: Is it a waste of time to teach yourself data science without a degree?

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Re: Ask HN: Is it a waste of time to teach yourself data science without a degree?

#11
post #2

You seem to assume that the only use for knowledge is garnering employment: this is patently false, as you could easily learn something and apply it for your own pleasure in the non-professional domain. P.S. It's called ’statistics’.

I wasn't assuming that at all. Just wondering about the real world prospects for someone self taught.

Re: Ask HN: Is it a waste of time to teach yourself data science without a degree?

#12
Bum on a seat using the Python free tools as a blackbox and the internet as a reference then? In most business cases it would work just fine but employers want to buy the most they can in advance, that's why degrees as a filter. Your best shot is showing up with one or more interesting, unheard case studies to gain attention.

Re: Ask HN: Is it a waste of time to teach yourself data science without a degree?

#13

It depends on how you define "data science". If you are like AWS and say that using logistic regression is machine learning, then yes, you can teach yourself data science. Learn SQL, read a couple of books on logistic regression, use some open data for building a couple of models. There are many companies where you can have a decent job and an easy living with SQL and logistic regression on your tool belt. If you say…

> no, you can not teach yourself data science. You will need at least one degree. Or more.

Why not? What is it that prevents anyone from learning anything without getting a degree? I disagree with your statement, I think it might be harder, but I don't think anyone "cannot teach themselves X".

Re: Ask HN: Is it a waste of time to teach yourself data science without a degree?

#14

It depends on how you define "data science". If you are like AWS and say that using logistic regression is machine learning, then yes, you can teach yourself data science. Learn SQL, read a couple of books on logistic regression, use some open data for building a couple of models. There are many companies where you can have a decent job and an easy living with SQL and logistic regression on your tool belt. If you say…

> no, you can not teach yourself data science. You will need at least one degree. Or more. Why not? What is it that prevents anyone from learning anything without getting a degree? I disagree with your statement, I think it might be harder, but I don't think anyone "cannot teach themselves X".

I agree with parts of both statements. On one hand, if you're looking to seriously get into data science then it's going to be hard to even get interviews with companies that are looking for real data scientists without those pieces of paper (diplomas). On the other hand, I agree that with enough dedication and effort you can teach yourself anything (after all, university is largely just you teaching yourself with the help of a schedule set by an institution).

Re: Ask HN: Is it a waste of time to teach yourself data science without a degree?

#15
It's possible, but definitely challenging. I did exactly this last year and got several offers, including prestigious companies, but I didn't have my pick of jobs as I did before and had to make some trade offs to be doing what I wanted, but it's definitely possible if you're a talented dev.

Re: Ask HN: Is it a waste of time to teach yourself data science without a degree?

#16
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> no, you can not teach yourself data science. You will need at least one degree. Or more. Why not? What is it that prevents anyone from learning anything without getting a degree? I disagree with your statement, I think it might be harder, but I don't think anyone "cannot teach themselves X".

I agree with parts of both statements. On one hand, if you're looking to seriously get into data science then it's going to be hard to even get interviews with companies that are looking for real data scientists without those pieces of paper (diplomas). On the other hand, I agree that with enough dedication and effort you can teach yourself anything (after all, university is largely just you teaching yourself with th…

I don't want to design the next self driving car.

Just design models that deliver business value.

Re: Ask HN: Is it a waste of time to teach yourself data science without a degree?

#17
Does anyone have experience with this scenario and actually completed Udacity nanodegrees for Machine Learning or Data Science or AI?

Their programs express job placement as a perk of graduation.

https://www.udacity.com/nanodegree

Educating for the "jobs of the future" is one of Udacity's goals, data scientist being one of those jobs.

Re: Ask HN: Is it a waste of time to teach yourself data science without a degree?

#18
Don't have a degree myself and about a third of the people I hire also don't have one. Why? Because I don't give anything about them.

I'd say if you don't want to work for a large, respected company first, it's a waste of time. Your degree is your entry ticket to your first job, not more. Later on, you can even work at Google if you want - just make a great product and get acquihired.

Three tips on what you should do instead:

1) BUILD something and show off your skills. Like, continuously. Always have your own challenges, do something about them, put your code online on Github. Host it so it can be seen and played with. Work towards a goal and learn what you need to learn on the side.

2) Focus on applying to companies not listing a degree in their job ad. You'll see there are quite a lot of them.

3) Don't focus on your lack of a degree in any interviews. Don't deny it, but just don't make it seem a deal. Often times, people won't even ask.

Re: Ask HN: Is it a waste of time to teach yourself data science without a degree?

#19

It depends on how you define "data science". If you are like AWS and say that using logistic regression is machine learning, then yes, you can teach yourself data science. Learn SQL, read a couple of books on logistic regression, use some open data for building a couple of models. There are many companies where you can have a decent job and an easy living with SQL and logistic regression on your tool belt. If you say…

> no, you can not teach yourself data science. You will need at least one degree. Or more. Why not? What is it that prevents anyone from learning anything without getting a degree? I disagree with your statement, I think it might be harder, but I don't think anyone "cannot teach themselves X".

Business fundamentals rely on norms, whether we like it or not. As a society, we rely on credentialing for complex matters. Sure, while anyone can absolutely learn to build a self driving car without a degree, here are two very likely paths as a result:

1. Company hires this data scientist, but regulators are skeptical of the efficacy of his/her implementation. 2. Companies adopt this notion that everyone can be a data scientist, build self driving cars, and the cars turn out to be a very error prone, imposing harm.

Businesses have to set a bar somewhere to ensure their expected return on data scientist is positive. Just like pharma execs & investors vet their scientists, highly complex data science positions will require convincing the players (investors, regulators...etc.) that your guy is legit. A pharma company would never endorse Walter White as their scientist responsible for delivering drugs.

Re: Ask HN: Is it a waste of time to teach yourself data science without a degree?

#20
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> no, you can not teach yourself data science. You will need at least one degree. Or more. Why not? What is it that prevents anyone from learning anything without getting a degree? I disagree with your statement, I think it might be harder, but I don't think anyone "cannot teach themselves X".

I agree with parts of both statements. On one hand, if you're looking to seriously get into data science then it's going to be hard to even get interviews with companies that are looking for real data scientists without those pieces of paper (diplomas). On the other hand, I agree that with enough dedication and effort you can teach yourself anything (after all, university is largely just you teaching yourself with th…

My company is hiring data scientists all the time. Nobody looks at the education section of the resume of the candidates we get. We look at what the person has actually done, and then we interview to make sure the resume wasn't filled with lies about that experience.
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