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The licensing program for MP3-related patents has been terminated

iis.fraunhofer.de

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Re: The licensing program for MP3-related patents has been terminated

#121

Post by incompatible »

TD-Linux wrote: post #105
throwaway91111 wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you "support a format"? AFAIK nothing will convince Apple to release music in a better (patent-free) codec, much less convince others to dump DRM.

If buying from iTunes, you can choose ALAC, which is royalty free. Patent-encumbered audio codecs are popular at this point because of network effects, not technical superiority. There are many ways to reduce the network effect, even without changing music buying habits. For example If you're a website designer, include a royalty-free audio format as one of your srcs. As a bonus, you'll save some bandwidth.

Isn't MP3 a royalty-free audio format now that its patents have expired?

Re: The licensing program for MP3-related patents has been terminated

#122

Post by microwavecamera »

JohnJamesRambo wrote: post #91
vkou wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The argument for why software patents are different is premised by why patents exist. They exist to grant someone a monopoly in exchange for them sharing their invention with the world. If I patent a dishwasher that does not clog, I will be rewarded for my invention... But once the patent expires, a skilled engineer will be able to look at my patent, and build a dishwasher that does not clog - in far less time then i…

With your ideas about patents someone should do it out of the kindness of their heart I guess. Is that what has driven most technological advancements of the human race? In your software-patentless world, why would a genius choose to work in software as opposed to another field inventing patentable tangible objects where he or she will be monetarily rewarded for it and able to make a living? Don't say you are already…

The problem is software isn't tangible. Something like an algorithm is different. It's mathematically provable. The vast majority of software patents are based on preexisting concepts such as the patent IBM was awarded for "Resolution of Abbreviated Text in an Electronic Communications System", which is a database that looks up abbreviations like netspeak and fills in the full word. Or Google's patent for "Variable User Interface Based on Document Access Privileges" which shows something different on a webpage based on your geographical location. Something websites had been doing for years. These frivolous software patents by major tech companies are predatory and stifle innovation. They know the patents won't hold up in court, but they can afford protracted legal battles startups cant and use that leverage to strong-arm smaller companies.

Re: The licensing program for MP3-related patents has been terminated

#123

Post by derefr »

out_of_protocol wrote: post #76
bsder wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem now is battery. MP3 almost always has hardware decode which is really power efficient. This isn't as bad nowadays since audio decode isn't that intensive relative to keeping your WiFi on.

opus can be decoded by hardware as well, (seek by name VP9 or webm) - most modern arm chipsets do so

...such as those used in the majority of Android/iOS devices? That'd be the important bit.

Re: The licensing program for MP3-related patents has been terminated

#124

Post by illicium »

alexbeloi wrote: post #110
throwaway91111 wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you "support a format"? AFAIK nothing will convince Apple to release music in a better (patent-free) codec, much less convince others to dump DRM.

As an engineer? You can influence design decisions and standards for the products your company makes. Somebody at apple decided AAC was better than MP3 because of it has better licensing for distributors, they could have gone further to consider codecs which had liberal licensing towards codec developers/manufacturers.

AAC is also higher quality than MP3 at medium bitrates[1], but this is largely irrelevant for high-bitrate iTunes downloads.

[1] http://listening-test.coresv.net/results.htm

Re: The licensing program for MP3-related patents has been terminated

#125

Post by voltagex_ »

TD-Linux wrote: post #105
throwaway91111 wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you "support a format"? AFAIK nothing will convince Apple to release music in a better (patent-free) codec, much less convince others to dump DRM.

If buying from iTunes, you can choose ALAC, which is royalty free. Patent-encumbered audio codecs are popular at this point because of network effects, not technical superiority. There are many ways to reduce the network effect, even without changing music buying habits. For example If you're a website designer, include a royalty-free audio format as one of your srcs. As a bonus, you'll save some bandwidth.

How do I "choose" ALAC? I thought only select albums were available losslessly.

Support Bandcamp. Support Databeats (storefront for many drum 'n' bass labels). Hell, support Beatport and Juno, even though they insist on huge markups for WAV/FLAC.

Re: The licensing program for MP3-related patents has been terminated

#126

Post by mattkevan »

ryukafalz wrote: post #104
throwaway91111 wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have a suggestion? Where can I find Rihanna in Ogg/Vorbis?

The simplest thing, IMO, is just to buy your music on CD and rip it to a free format yourself. Some indie artists release their work online in free formats, but for mainstream artists a physical copy is often the only way.

Buy from Bandcamp.

Support indie artists and buy music in MP3, FLAC, Apple Lossless, AAC, Ogg Vorbis, WAV or AIFF.

Re: The licensing program for MP3-related patents has been terminated

#127

Post by [deleted] »

ryukafalz wrote: post #104
throwaway91111 wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have a suggestion? Where can I find Rihanna in Ogg/Vorbis?

The simplest thing, IMO, is just to buy your music on CD and rip it to a free format yourself. Some indie artists release their work online in free formats, but for mainstream artists a physical copy is often the only way.

[deleted]

Re: The licensing program for MP3-related patents has been terminated

#128

Post by ams6110 »

PhasmaFelis wrote: post #49
TD-Linux wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

MP3 is the worst performer of the lot, but is suddenly more attractive because it's free and AAC is decidedly not. If you don't need compatibility (like for bgm/sfx) it's still a worse choice than Vorbis or Opus because it compresses worse. For sfx and looping music in particular, mp3 is also a mess because there's no standard way to play back samples with zero delay and zero extra samples at the end.

I vaguely recall that Vorbis requires a fair bit more processing to decompress, enough to be a potential issue 15 years ago, but on modern computers it's barely detectable and doesn't effect performance at all.

I concur based on experience. I have a cheap music player that will play Ogg-Vorbis files but it skips and stutters. mp3 files play flawlessly.

Re: The licensing program for MP3-related patents has been terminated

#129

Post by sutro »

microwavecamera wrote: post #109
throwaway91111 wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have a suggestion? Where can I find Rihanna in Ogg/Vorbis?

Rihanna? Well that's your first problem.

Some people, when confronted with a problem, think "I know, I'll listen to Rihanna." Now they have two problems.

Re: The licensing program for MP3-related patents has been terminated

#130

Post by sjwright »

illicium wrote: post #124
alexbeloi wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As an engineer? You can influence design decisions and standards for the products your company makes. Somebody at apple decided AAC was better than MP3 because of it has better licensing for distributors, they could have gone further to consider codecs which had liberal licensing towards codec developers/manufacturers.

AAC is also higher quality than MP3 at medium bitrates[1], but this is largely irrelevant for high-bitrate iTunes downloads. [1] http://listening-test.coresv.net/results.htm

You can only say that because of the astonishing improvements to MP3 encoding over the past fifteen years. Back in 2003 when Apple opened the iTunes Store, AAC was substantially better than MP3 at all bitrates, most particularly the 128 kbps rate Apple initially used.

In fact the decision would have been made back in 2001 or earlier, given that the original iPod released in 2001 supported AAC decoding.

(The music labels also forced Apple to encrypt everything, therefore there was no incentive to use an open format. Had they used encrypted Vorbis, that would have been seen as a giant middle finger to open source.)

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