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Why Deutsche Bundesbank had to promise to leave 1200 tons of gold in New York

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Re: Why Deutsche Bundesbank had to promise to leave 1200 tons of gold in New York

#131

Post by mamon »

sgt101 wrote: post #129

I think that at 41k per kilo one tonne of gold is worth $41m. 1300 tonnes of gold is therefore worth a bit more than $51bn, which is a lot, but approximately 1 year of the UK's defence budget, so in the scale of things not really all that much. Now, this would mean that (given that Germany is a big economy) there would be what... 20 times that amount of gold available to back a gold currency - so about $1trn. I think…

Gold is valued at only $41k per kilo because central banks managed to convince us that we don't need it to back up our currency.

If China really created gold-backed currency then gold price would skyrocket, increasing at lest 6 times (that's how much inflation we had since 1971, when the gold standard was abandoned)

Re: Why Deutsche Bundesbank had to promise to leave 1200 tons of gold in New York

#132

Post by comicjk »

sandworm101 wrote: post #120
erikb wrote: post #36

> Gold is money, which is based on physical ownership, not on trust in the willingness and ability of another party to honor their promises. If you have gold, but you do not have it under your control, it is almost pointless to have gold. Really digging this one. That's why I proactively not listen to investors/consultants who suggest to buy some gold derivates for savety purposes. In other regards: What's the point…

Gold is no longer tied to power. Real estate now defines who is to be king. Look to the wealth funds of the middle east. They dont trade oil for gold these days. They buy land, the real international currency. The man with the most diversified land across many countries is king.

In the past, diversified land holdings across many countries haven't been a great strategy, because they're too difficult for the foreign owner to hold on to politically and military. Land is expensive to protect.

Re: Why Deutsche Bundesbank had to promise to leave 1200 tons of gold in New York

#133

Post by reitanqild »

mamon wrote: post #117
reitanqild wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

because the ultimate goal of EU was to give the Germans control over the Europe without using military force That sounds extremely fishy. Why would UK and France want to support a project like that? But, Switzerland is NOT an EU member, so that's a different story :) GP didn't say another EU member but rather a neighbour.

>>Why would UK and France want to support a project like that? They wouldn't, hence the Brexit :) Also, in the beginning it wasn't sole German domination, rather, it was German-French duopoly [1][2]. But now French economy got weaker, so that they are not equal partner to Germany anymore, and guess what? There are some politicians in France talking about Frexit [3], or at least giving up Euro as currency (which would…

Something about extraordinary claims and extraordinary evidence.

I see only the first.

Re: Why Deutsche Bundesbank had to promise to leave 1200 tons of gold in New York

#134

Post by mattnewton »

mannykannot wrote: post #110
patrickk wrote: post #2

Bloomberg has a very interesting article on this topic also: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2015-02-05/germany-s... Reading in between the lines, it seems as if a good chunk of gold has gone missing and there is an attempt by both sides to save face.

This puts me in mind of the rai stones of Yap, and particularly of one that was lost at sea, but which continued to be used in transactions because of a general agreement that it still existed and so its ownership could be recognized. I have lost track of the clearest version of this story that I have seen, but it is mentioned in the 'Transfers by Clearing' section here: http://www.wondermondo.com/Countries/Au/Micron…

I read about this in Felix Martin's Money: The Unauthorized Biography, which was quite good (in my uninformed opinion).

Re: Why Deutsche Bundesbank had to promise to leave 1200 tons of gold in New York

#135

Post by panarky »

owenversteeg wrote: post #73
phyalow wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll just leave this here: http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-03-02/why-jpmorgans-gold-...

As fascinating as that is, what I find to be even more interesting is that the total wealth in that insane concrete-bubble structure built to withstand atomic attack... is just over a billion USD. That's nothing in the scale of global wealth. And that's the largest gold vault on Earth. Pretty disappointing if you ask me. The entire gold vault (one million ounces of gold) is worth about a third of one percent of JPMor…

Exactly this.

What is it about gold that triggers wild conspiracy theories from seemingly rational people?

Re: Why Deutsche Bundesbank had to promise to leave 1200 tons of gold in New York

#136

Post by oxryly1 »

phyalow wrote: post #7
patrickk wrote: post #2

Bloomberg has a very interesting article on this topic also: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2015-02-05/germany-s... Reading in between the lines, it seems as if a good chunk of gold has gone missing and there is an attempt by both sides to save face.

I'll just leave this here: http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-03-02/why-jpmorgans-gold-...

Off topic, but what is up with comments on zerohedge.com? Not this article necessarily, but so many of the articles on that site it seems the comments are just ridiculous alt-right bot armies arguing back and forth, peppered with links to obviously newly-invented sites touting crackpot theories.

Re: Why Deutsche Bundesbank had to promise to leave 1200 tons of gold in New York

#137

Post by gumby »

b5u wrote: post #123
sandworm101 wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Gold is no longer tied to power. Real estate now defines who is to be king. Look to the wealth funds of the middle east. They dont trade oil for gold these days. They buy land, the real international currency. The man with the most diversified land across many countries is king.

Land may be valuable at the moment, but that will likely change in the future when fresh, clean water will be more scarce and climate changes will render parts of Earth uninhabitable. I'd recommend you reading this interview with M. Burry (guy who foresaw the real-estate crises in '08): http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2015/12/big-short-geniu...

That's still a real estate issue; you're just saying that the three important factors in real estate are "location, location, and location" and that those factors aren't stable over time. Tell that to the Carthaginians.

Re: Why Deutsche Bundesbank had to promise to leave 1200 tons of gold in New York

#138

Post by JumpCrisscross »

erikb wrote: post #36

> Gold is money, which is based on physical ownership, not on trust in the willingness and ability of another party to honor their promises. If you have gold, but you do not have it under your control, it is almost pointless to have gold. Really digging this one. That's why I proactively not listen to investors/consultants who suggest to buy some gold derivates for savety purposes. In other regards: What's the point…

Gold sort of works for sovereigns. It's crap for individuals. Any situation where you need to rely on physical gold is a situation where someone else will take it from you by force.

Re: Why Deutsche Bundesbank had to promise to leave 1200 tons of gold in New York

#139

Post by gumby »

oxryly1 wrote: post #136
phyalow wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll just leave this here: http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-03-02/why-jpmorgans-gold-...

Off topic, but what is up with comments on zerohedge.com? Not this article necessarily, but so many of the articles on that site it seems the comments are just ridiculous alt-right bot armies arguing back and forth, peppered with links to obviously newly-invented sites touting crackpot theories.

Despite (or because of?) the fact that quite a surprisingly high number of my friends read zero hedge, I've always referred to it as a "gold standard flat-earther conspiracy site."

I will say that, like a stopped clock, it generates something meaningful once in a while. But so does a Markov model.

Re: Why Deutsche Bundesbank had to promise to leave 1200 tons of gold in New York

#140

Post by JumpCrisscross »

mamon wrote: post #131
sgt101 wrote: post #129

I think that at 41k per kilo one tonne of gold is worth $41m. 1300 tonnes of gold is therefore worth a bit more than $51bn, which is a lot, but approximately 1 year of the UK's defence budget, so in the scale of things not really all that much. Now, this would mean that (given that Germany is a big economy) there would be what... 20 times that amount of gold available to back a gold currency - so about $1trn. I think…

Gold is valued at only $41k per kilo because central banks managed to convince us that we don't need it to back up our currency. If China really created gold-backed currency then gold price would skyrocket, increasing at lest 6 times (that's how much inflation we had since 1971, when the gold standard was abandoned)

Fine, 6x. $300bn. Considerable amount of money, but still comparable to the value of a handful of neighbourhoods' real estate in Manhattan.
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