Why I Don't Prepare for Job Interviews • Hacker News Board

Re: Why I Don't Prepare for Job Interviews

#31

Post by dogma1138 » Fri, Apr 28, 2017, 4:23 PM UTC

>Cramming may get a candidate a job. But they won’t succeed at the job if they don’t have the skills and experience needed.

This is a fallacy, you'll encounter things that you are not "qualified" to do on the job all the time, not to mention that if you are applying for an engineering job, or any other job that effectively requires you to solve problems; then learning new things, performing studies and research and finding a solution to the problem is your job description.

If the role is such that a candidate can have 100% of the experience and knowledge needed to perform that role during it's entire lifetime than that role is effectively the burger flipping of the tech world. This role is also the easiest to automate since apparently all the answers and knowledge needed to fulfil are known.

Re: Why I Don't Prepare for Job Interviews

#32

Post by Jedd » Fri, Apr 28, 2017, 4:24 PM UTC

neogodless wrote: post #22

> A candidate should have the experience to do the job well. I feel like this is the least true statement in the article. A candidate should have the willingness and ability to learn the skills required to perform the job duties, and improve those skills over time. They should have some basic building block skills required in advance, like understanding how code languages work, and how to learn them, or how to commun…

I tend to agree. The article resonated with my experiences for the most part, but some lines felt out of place, such as:

> Taking one of them would have set me back in my career since I would not have the skills I would have needed to do the job well.

There's a massive disparity in most jobs between experience demanded for, and (potential) experience on offer to be gained from, the particular role.

When I've sat on the recruiter side of the desk I've always been a bit wary about people who have a superset of the skills required for a job -- they're going to be very bored, very quickly. When I've sat on the other side of the desk I've had trouble verbalising, to the panel, the benefits of considering a candidate who has 70-90% of the skills or experience they're looking for.

Re: Why I Don't Prepare for Job Interviews

#33

Post by groupuser » Fri, Apr 28, 2017, 4:28 PM UTC

The author makes the implicit assumption that success in a software interview means success in the workplace, and vice versa. This may be true for some interview processes, but this idea can't be generalized across the industry.

Re: Why I Don't Prepare for Job Interviews

#34

Post by bla2 » Fri, Apr 28, 2017, 4:30 PM UTC

stale2002 wrote: post #11

micheljansen wrote: post #2

Good piece, but misleading title. There is a big difference between "cramming" and preparing. Like the author says: "Preparing by learning about a company and its product makes sense. But preparing for an interview by cramming/studying material that is supposedly needed for the job makes no sense." When I get a candidate who has no sense of the job they are applying for and is not able to ask meaningful questions, it…

The issue is that companies like Google EXPECT you to cram on algorithms before the interview. They will even give you a study guide! Being really good at programming on a whiteboard is the name of the game. And studying for this is absolutely useful, and not "cheating" because everyone does it and is expected to do it.

I used to work at Google. I didn't study for the interviews, I just showed up. It went well enough to be hired. I did study CS and know my algorithms and data structures though.

Re: Why I Don't Prepare for Job Interviews

#35

Post by monster_group » Fri, Apr 28, 2017, 4:30 PM UTC

joshstrange wrote: post #17

I always "prepare" for interviews, I learn about the company, what they do, their stack if it's public, etc. I don't bone up on my knowledge of programming or how to implement an N(x) sort or anything like that. If I don't know it then I don't know it and cramming to try and show off that yes I listened in my CS classes back in college seem disingenuous and misleading. I will succeed or fail on my own merits and I wi…

But if you learnt how to implement quick sort before an interview and it proved useful in your interview, then you are succeeding on your merit. It's not like you are cheating during the interview. At the time of interview you do know how to implement the algorithm and that is your merit.

Re: Why I Don't Prepare for Job Interviews

#36

Post by xsegfault » Fri, Apr 28, 2017, 4:35 PM UTC

bla2 wrote: post #34

stale2002 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The issue is that companies like Google EXPECT you to cram on algorithms before the interview. They will even give you a study guide! Being really good at programming on a whiteboard is the name of the game. And studying for this is absolutely useful, and not "cheating" because everyone does it and is expected to do it.

I used to work at Google. I didn't study for the interviews, I just showed up. It went well enough to be hired. I did study CS and know my algorithms and data structures though.

You are probably part of a really a small percentage.

Re: Why I Don't Prepare for Job Interviews

#37

Post by zzbzq » Fri, Apr 28, 2017, 4:36 PM UTC

dogma1138 wrote: post #31

>Cramming may get a candidate a job. But they won’t succeed at the job if they don’t have the skills and experience needed. This is a fallacy, you'll encounter things that you are not "qualified" to do on the job all the time, not to mention that if you are applying for an engineering job, or any other job that effectively requires you to solve problems; then learning new things, performing studies and research and f…

That objection could be seen as compatible with the original thesis in the title, though. Equate the need to work with unexpected things on the job, with improvising a job interview. In both cases, you need to expand beyond your knowledge, but you also need a baseline of knowledge and ability to even get started.

Re: Why I Don't Prepare for Job Interviews

#38

Post by monster_group » Fri, Apr 28, 2017, 4:37 PM UTC

The author is giving way too much credit to the interview process and way undermining his abilities. Interviewers are humans just like the interviewee and the process can be (and is in fact) screwed up. Interview performance has little correlation with actual job performance. You do whatever you have to do get in the door and learn new skills on the job. He is missing out on some great opportunities (and most likely salary) by having this attitude.

Re: Why I Don't Prepare for Job Interviews

#39

Post by zerr » Fri, Apr 28, 2017, 4:42 PM UTC

brudgers wrote: post #30

stale2002 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The issue is that companies like Google EXPECT you to cram on algorithms before the interview. They will even give you a study guide! Being really good at programming on a whiteboard is the name of the game. And studying for this is absolutely useful, and not "cheating" because everyone does it and is expected to do it.

Most companies aren't like Google. It makes sense for Google to encourage cramming on algorithms because the type of programmer Google does not need is one who "doesn't do algorithms" and so the cramming expectation filters against those. The type of programmer Google wants is one who can cram for algorithms in the sense that when there is a problem, the programmer can sit down and research algorithms and distinguish…

> Google does not need is one who "doesn't do algorithms" and so the cramming expectation filters against those.

Except they filter those who "doesn't do algorithms" for free (the prep/cramming takes about 6 months I believe)...

Re: Why I Don't Prepare for Job Interviews

#40

Post by mannykannot » Fri, Apr 28, 2017, 4:55 PM UTC

There is an important caveat in the last paragraph of the article:

"Granted, all of this implies that companies have actually created an interview that actually tests the skills needed for the position they are hiring for."