In Bay Area, six-figure salaries are “low income” • Hacker News Board

Re: In Bay Area, six-figure salaries are “low income”

#231

Post by xaa » Tue, Apr 25, 2017, 5:30 PM UTC

I must say that as someone who does NOT live in a crazy high-rent state or town, I am not well pleased by the idea of my federal tax dollars going to people who choose to live there but can't make ends meet, and this even though I'm generally pro-spending on social welfare.

You may say, "but the poor can't afford to move!". Well, if that's the case, the government should subsidize their move instead. It would be way cheaper and would incidentally drive real estate prices closer to the national median.

I'm not trying to cast any blame on people in this situation, as they are likely there through no fault of their own, but this can hardly be the most efficient way to solve the problem.

I feel like economics is screaming a message to people in the Bay Area: "There are too many people here! There's tons of land in the U.S.!", but no one is listening, just casting blame on the techies, gentrification, land policy, or whatever.

Re: In Bay Area, six-figure salaries are “low income”

#232

Post by DiNovi » Tue, Apr 25, 2017, 5:31 PM UTC

ransom1538 wrote: post #46

archeantus wrote: post #6

Wow, this resonates with me. In 2013 my wife and I were living in the Bay Area and had just welcomed our third child into the family. I was making 105k/yr at Apple (which seemed like a ton at the time!) but I felt like I was saving very little of that. I was approached on LinkedIn to take a job with matching pay but that was fully remote. I could live anywhere I wanted in the entire country. I jumped at the chance an…

Did the exact same thing this year. Moved to Oviedo, FL from SF: 1) no state income tax, 2) public schools in my neighborhood are equivalent to a private school in sf [i] 4) weather is great 8 months out of year, 5) beaches you can swim in, 6) rent is ~1/4 of what it was in SF, 7) cuban food, 8) as a resident, kids have year round disney passes [i] http://school-ratings.com/Florida/schools/Carillon_Elementar... WARNI…

Orlando... really...?

Re: In Bay Area, six-figure salaries are “low income”

#233

Post by nrclark » Tue, Apr 25, 2017, 5:31 PM UTC

archeantus wrote: post #20

gshulegaard wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just curious, as an engineer finding myself thinking along similar lines, where did you end up moving?

We moved to Utah where the tech scene is actually quite strong, and the cost of living is significantly less. We bought an 8k sq ft house for the price of many 1,500 sq ft town homes we had been putting offers in on in California. It can be such a rat race down there, it is refreshing to remember that it doesn't have to be that way. Life exists outside of The Valley, and it happens to be a pretty darn good one (and a…

I assume 8k is the lot size (~0.2 acre)? I had a similar experience moving to Colorado from CA.

Re: In Bay Area, six-figure salaries are “low income”

#234

Post by refurb » Tue, Apr 25, 2017, 5:31 PM UTC

grumblestumble wrote: post #140

ryanSrich wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honest question. I just looked at Redfin and the average house costs around $1.2mm. How would anyone making $130k with 4 dependents buy a house? You seem to fit that criteria so I'll ask you. How on earth did you afford that? Because based on my simple math there just isn't enough money for it to be possible.

My wife and I work full time, combined income is just below $400k. With a mortgage on a 3 bedroom in Oakland, daycare and after-school care costs, student loans, et al, we have never been more broke in our lives. I was living large when I was making $75k and not living in the Bay Area... now, it's beans and rice most nights, and hoping the early 2000's honda doesn't break down on the way to school.

Wait a second. You and your wife pulled in ~$30K per month pre-tax, so I'll be generous and say $15K per month after tax. Any you have never been more broke? Even with kids I'd be hard pressed to call that broke unless you had ridiculous student loans. And in that case, you're screwed where ever you live.

Re: In Bay Area, six-figure salaries are “low income”

#235

Post by danielcampos93 » Tue, Apr 25, 2017, 5:32 PM UTC

xweb wrote: post #89

ryanSrich wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just remember that you'll want to select a city that has a decent economy and tech scene in the event that you lose your job and need to take a location dictated position. So long as you and your partner are both making 6 figures you should be able to afford any of the following cities: - Seattle - Portland - Austin - Denver

I would strike Seattle from this list. Just over the last couple of years, home prices are up 50% or more. It's not SF/SV prices but it's 80-90% there...unfortunately. It is, however, easier to build in Washington, so hopefully this will be a bubble and not a permanent trend.

true this. Average sale price in seattle metro for march was just shy of 700k. The city is trying to be pretty aggressive about building but if you want to live in the city you are going to pay a lot. That being said, if you dont mind commuting you can get a nice place that is affordable(30 minutes commute to the city).

Re: In Bay Area, six-figure salaries are “low income”

#236

Post by DiNovi » Tue, Apr 25, 2017, 5:33 PM UTC

xaa wrote: post #231

I must say that as someone who does NOT live in a crazy high-rent state or town, I am not well pleased by the idea of my federal tax dollars going to people who choose to live there but can't make ends meet, and this even though I'm generally pro-spending on social welfare. You may say, "but the poor can't afford to move!". Well, if that's the case, the government should subsidize their move instead. It would be way…

You're discussing the government force relocating poor people. Think about that...

Re: In Bay Area, six-figure salaries are “low income”

#237

Post by wil421 » Tue, Apr 25, 2017, 5:33 PM UTC

JustSomeNobody wrote: post #103

nojvek wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Very tempted to visit Florida

As a Fl native, it's a great place to live. The political situation sucks, but ya can't have everything. Edit: Some tips for visitors. Most beaches are beautiful and most have free access. Enjoy, but wear sunscreen (and keep reapplying). Oh and bring lots of water; playing at the beach dehydrates you fast. If you pick a Gulf Coast beach (Clearwater is nice), as you enter the water, skoot your feet on the sand. That f…

>Georgia drivers ... can't. I jest. But seriously...

We have no patience for slow or dumb drivers in Atlanta.

Go Dawgs.

The panhandle has nice beaches as well.

Re: In Bay Area, six-figure salaries are “low income”

#238

Post by jjtheblunt » Tue, Apr 25, 2017, 5:33 PM UTC

baddox wrote: post #94

ransom1538 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did the exact same thing this year. Moved to Oviedo, FL from SF: 1) no state income tax, 2) public schools in my neighborhood are equivalent to a private school in sf [i] 4) weather is great 8 months out of year, 5) beaches you can swim in, 6) rent is ~1/4 of what it was in SF, 7) cuban food, 8) as a resident, kids have year round disney passes [i] http://school-ratings.com/Florida/schools/Carillon_Elementar... WARNI…

That sounds great, but one of the common rebuttals is that the job market (remote or otherwise) may be more challenging outside of the Bay Area.

That rebuttal is resoundingly false, though there is unspeakably great vested interest in perpetuating that myth, it seems.

Re: In Bay Area, six-figure salaries are “low income”

#239

Post by michaelt » Tue, Apr 25, 2017, 5:33 PM UTC

praneshp wrote: post #27

rogy wrote: post #16

Interestingly similar discussion going around in the UK at the moment after a UK MP came out saying that '£70,000' salary makes you 'rich'. 70k as a single income won't get you a flat in London in any reasonable time and you'll most certainly be renting forever on that kind if money in London. Even if its triple the average UK wage. Location means everything.

Actually at a previous job (at the front page of HN today for CEO severance) I started developing sympathy for politicians who say things like that. I saw how out of touch upper management was with what was actually going on, and in something like government it's at a much higher order of magnitude. Doesn't excuse them, but I can understand how they say such things.

Saying that a £70,000 salary makes you rich sounds like sensible politics to me.

In the UK the median pre-tax income is £22,400 with £72,000 putting you in the 95th percentile [1]; £70,000 is in the middle of the pay scale for a salaried GP/family doctor [2]; and MPs receive a base salary of £74,000 [3] (plus a bunch of extra income through a variety of opaque means)

I think you would look pretty out of touch, from the perspective of someone earning £22,400 if you claimed earning £70,000 didn't make you rich.

[1] https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/percentile-points-f... [2] https://www.bma.org.uk/advice/employment/pay/general-practit... [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salaries_of_Members_of_the_Uni...

Re: In Bay Area, six-figure salaries are “low income”

#240

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Apr 25, 2017, 5:34 PM UTC

anon374939 wrote: post #175

nilved wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This post is hilarious. You're the embodiment of HN.

Yeah, first world problem I know :) Everything's a matter of perspective. Ultimately I want my future kids to have a quality of life similar or greater than I had growing up, and I just didn't think that would be possible in the Bay (at least not without taking on the much higher stress that would likely accompany a much higher income)

[deleted]