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CEO of ThinkPenguin, Inc arrested for filming police

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Re: CEO of ThinkPenguin, Inc arrested for filming police

#231

Post by user5994461 »

grzm wrote: post #218
user5994461 wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed, that's an assault rifle, predecessor to the M16. Only available as semi-automatic for civilian, if not modified. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AR-15_variant I don't know how you American call that, but I'd consider that as war equipment.

I don't know how you American call that, but I'd consider that as war equipment. The rest of your comment is informative and adds to the discussion. Your parent is making a similar point, which you expand on. This last statement you add is can be read as inflammatory. Gun discussions are contentious enough as it is, particularly on the internet, and they all to often derail into all manner of increasingly flamewar to…

Because there are different culture surrounding firearms, particular classifications and regulations.

In most countries, this sort of equipment is definitely classified as war guns. You are prohibited from possessing one, let alone use it.

In the USA, it's more opened, some stuff you can buy, some stuff you can't buy, not sure where this one is. I believe it's being discussed in another thread here.

This has implications on the story. Knowing the kind of weapon and the local norms would give more context about the situation. Expect the police to react differently against a handgun and a military grade assault rifle (not the same type of individual on the other side either).

Judging by the "hundreds of rounds", it might have been modified to automatic or it's an old model.

Re: CEO of ThinkPenguin, Inc arrested for filming police

#232

Post by Rebelgecko »

grzm wrote: post #225
tomschlick wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> with a machine gun Ugh. I wish reporters would stop embellishing stories like that with words they don't understand. An AR-15 is not in any sense a "machine gun".

Do you have a reference for knowing the firearm was an AR-15? The original CBS Sacramento article[0] (which the above Ars Technica story references), a neighbor was reported as "firing up to 100 machine gun rounds at a home across the street". From this alone, it's pretty ambiguous as to the firearm involved. Granted, often journalists all-to-often misreport "automatic" vs "semi-automatic" and "machine gun" and "assa…

I don't have any info to add about this particular case, but in CA the law he was charged with breaking (the articles I've found just say "assault with a machine gun" ) covers actual machine guns, 50bmg rifles, anything that California deems an assault weapon (which more or less means centerfire rifles with adjustable stocks or pistol grips, eg most AR-15s).

Re: CEO of ThinkPenguin, Inc arrested for filming police

#233

Post by nkkollaw »

dec0dedab0de wrote: post #87
nkkollaw wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I only met cool cops in the US (perhaps because they saw I was a foreigner). However, I do agree that in Europe you don't feel threatened at all by them, and that doesn't seem to be true in the States. There seems to be a trend in the US to treat everyone like criminals by default, while in Europe until they think you've done something wrong they're extremely nice (as they should). Although you were downvoted, it wou…

Although you were downvoted, it would be interesting to understand why that is. I'm guessing he was down-voted for the language, not the meaning.

Yes, I thought so, but the point he raised was interesting.

Re: CEO of ThinkPenguin, Inc arrested for filming police

#234

Post by [deleted] »

tomschlick wrote: post #222
user5994461 wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed, that's an assault rifle, predecessor to the M16. Only available as semi-automatic for civilian, if not modified. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AR-15_variant I don't know how you American call that, but I'd consider that as war equipment.

"Assault Rifle" is a defined term as well which is basically the same as "machine gun". Both require the weapon to be "select fire" which means it can be set to fire more than one round per trigger pull. An AR-15 is neither an Assault Rifle nor a Machine Gun. In actuality, an AR-15 is the same as any other semi-automatic rifle in function. It just looks scarier so it's treated different than others. For example, many…

[deleted]

Re: CEO of ThinkPenguin, Inc arrested for filming police

#235

Post by tomschlick »

user5994461 wrote: post #231
grzm wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know how you American call that, but I'd consider that as war equipment. The rest of your comment is informative and adds to the discussion. Your parent is making a similar point, which you expand on. This last statement you add is can be read as inflammatory. Gun discussions are contentious enough as it is, particularly on the internet, and they all to often derail into all manner of increasingly flamewar to…

Because there are different culture surrounding firearms, particular classifications and regulations. In most countries, this sort of equipment is definitely classified as war guns. You are prohibited from possessing one, let alone use it. In the USA, it's more opened, some stuff you can buy, some stuff you can't buy, not sure where this one is. I believe it's being discussed in another thread here. This has implicat…

> Judging by the "hundreds of rounds", it might have been modified to automatic or it's an old model.

Most likely not, you can empty 30 round mags in 15 seconds or so.

Re: CEO of ThinkPenguin, Inc arrested for filming police

#236

Post by EGreg »

maxerickson wrote: post #217
EGreg wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Suppose your cost for an event goes from $5,000 to $500,000. Do you think you may make different choices to try and prevent this event? That is the difference in how many guns there are among the population.

Yes, I think we both understand the comparison well enough, the disagreement is about the characterization. My position is that police feeling nervous about guns shouldn't factor into their rules of engagement, because the statistics show that violent encounters are extremely rare. I don't want to mischaracterize your position so I'll leave you to make a comparable statement if you want.

Thank you. Well it's simple: we agree that violent encounters are rare. And we presumably agree that it's not the incidence rate but that times the cost of being shot that informs your actions. So the actions can very well be changed by even a 1% chance per encounter of something like that. Would you fly with a 1% chance of death? How would that affect the economy?

Re: CEO of ThinkPenguin, Inc arrested for filming police

#237

Post by ythn »

MaxfordAndSons wrote: post #163
ythn wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> so maybe the US does qualify as a war zone. It sure does. We are constantly at war against tyranny and citizen owned guns are one of our best weapons. I don't think any other "developed country" has been democratic as long as we have without lapsing back into tyranny every other century.

Interesting, could you point out some recent (anytime post 1780s) examples of the armed US citizenry using our weapons to defend against tyranny?

Guns are are more like mosquito repellent with tyranny being the mosquito. I.e. it's usually a passive defense against tyranny not an active one.

I can give you examples of countries where guns are banned and the governments eventually rode roughshod over the citizens (who couldn't do anything about it): For example, when the Jong-Il family came to power in N. Korea they cracked down extremely heavily on gun ownership to ensure armed uprisings were impossible. It has been an extremely effective measure and now N. Korea has the lowest gun homicide rate in the world.

Re: CEO of ThinkPenguin, Inc arrested for filming police

#238

Post by paulddraper »

bougiefever wrote: post #68
swsieber wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be fair, it probably looked like a gun from a distance. The police were in the neighborhood confronting somebody with a machine gun - not smart to take an action that looks like pointing a gun in a type of situation where one side has decided they need machine guns . It's not to excuse the behavior of the police..., but if you're pointing something at the police from across the street, it's hard to see the profile…

I think it's fair, if you're going to use deadly force, to first find out with a much, much greater degree of certainty, that there actually is a weapon, and if so that they actually are in danger. Too many cowardly and scared police shooting at shadows and noises. "It's not to excuse the behavior of the police.." And yes, your comment is excusing the behavior of the police. Just saying that you didn't just excuse th…

Police officers shot and killed last year: 63

Unarmed people shot and killed by police last year: 48

It's a touch predicament, but I don't see a universal lack of prudence.

https://www.odmp.org/search/year/2016

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/national/police-shoo...

Re: CEO of ThinkPenguin, Inc arrested for filming police

#239

Post by nylonstrung »

praneshp wrote: post #151
bonzini wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Assuming it's necessary to shoot at all, aiming to kill is even more rarely the right thing to do.

I'm by no means an expert gun-handler, but the only constant instruction every time I go to a range is "Don't point the gun at anything you are not ok with completely destroying". I understand police should be better trained, and ideally they must shoot to stop vs shoot to kill.

They already have non-lethal options available if they intend to stop someone. I feel like this would increase the lethality of situations where non-lethal approaches are warranted rather than decreasing the lethality of other ones.

Firearms should not be treated as implements of lethality and nothing but that. Imagine how many police shooting cases we'd see where cop claims he was shooting to wound but 'missed'

Re: CEO of ThinkPenguin, Inc arrested for filming police

#240

Post by user5994461 »

tomschlick wrote: post #235
user5994461 wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because there are different culture surrounding firearms, particular classifications and regulations. In most countries, this sort of equipment is definitely classified as war guns. You are prohibited from possessing one, let alone use it. In the USA, it's more opened, some stuff you can buy, some stuff you can't buy, not sure where this one is. I believe it's being discussed in another thread here. This has implicat…

> Judging by the "hundreds of rounds", it might have been modified to automatic or it's an old model. Most likely not, you can empty 30 round mags in 15 seconds or so.

Correct me if I am wrong but this weapon doesn't come with 30 round mags and these mags are not easily accessible for sale.
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