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Young White America Is Haunted by a Crisis of Despair

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Re: Young White America Is Haunted by a Crisis of Despair

#311

Post by okreallywtf »

marcosdumay wrote: post #295
okreallywtf wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The issue is this problem never went away. Minorities are still being punished disproportionately for drug use [1]. I don't think that we should let spite dictate our reaction to the opioid crisis but it indicates maybe its time to stop pretending that the drug war was a necessary evil, especially given we might be about to double-down on it (and most likely continuing to disproportionately convict minorities) [2]. […

So, you think it's wrong and that we should strive to make things better for everybody. I can agree with that.

Yes, but I can understand well enough where that sentiment comes from to not overreact when other people find it frustrating that we find empathy on drug issues that affect large numbers of white people. It doesn't have to be right for it to make sense and to have enough class to not pretend the drug war never happened. Just acknowledge it and take the high road.

Re: Young White America Is Haunted by a Crisis of Despair

#312

Post by castle-bravo »

Animats wrote: post #187
exhilaration wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> * Stock picking in an Amazon warehouse - robots taking over. I just wanted to offer a data point here, my buddy worked at the Amazon warehouse in Breinigsville PA a few months back and said he never saw a robot. Reading Hacker News I would have thought that Amazon had their robots widely deployed but that doesn't seem to be the case.

Amazon has fulfillment center generations. They usually don't automate existing fulfillment centers; they build new ones and close the old ones. Kiva robots went in at Gen-8, in 2014.[1][2] Breinigsville PA was built in 2011, so it's not a Gen-8 center but is too new to replace. [1] http://www.scdigest.com/ontarget/15-03-03-1.php?cid=9051 [2] https://vimeo.com/113374910

Is this an anti-union strategy?

Re: Young White America Is Haunted by a Crisis of Despair

#313

Post by emodendroket »

will_brown wrote: post #281
emodendroket wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd argue the cause and effect relationship you're positing is backwards.

As in you think the declines in mental health of children leads to an increase in divorce, dual income households and single parent homes?

What? No. I think it seems like the post I'm replying to wants to imply that the "crisis of despair" that is the topic of this discussion is caused by broken families, rather than broken families being caused by people not having any way to support a traditional family due to economic factors.

Re: Young White America Is Haunted by a Crisis of Despair

#314

Post by nostrademons »

marssaxman wrote: post #299
nostrademons wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consumer IoT is actually pretty appealing, but it's been incredibly poorly executed so far. I would love to be able to get breakfast started while I'm still in bed, or let guests DJ the party from their cell-phone, or have a robot put away my dishes as soon as the dishwasher is done, or automatically transfer the wash when it finishes. Or imagine a product that, when somebody leaves a package on your doorstep, alerts…

I can understand, abstractly, why the scenarios you describe might be appealing, but my actual emotional reaction is horror. Complicated systems fail in complicated ways, and the last thing I want in my home is anything that requires a long, fiddly, debugging process after it abruptly stops working for no apparent reason, as all automated gadgets periodically do. Debugging is most of what I do for a living! I don't w…

I wonder if people reacted the same way to the last wave of home appliances - the dishwashers, laundry machines, blenders, food processors, vacuum cleaners, and other machines that must've seemed like horrifying abominations to people used to doing those chores by hand.

Re: Young White America Is Haunted by a Crisis of Despair

#315

Post by rabboRubble »

devnullmonkey wrote: post #240
irrational wrote: post #6

I worry about this for my oldest son. He has dyspraxia and apraxia. In practice that means he has difficulty with memory (at 15 he still doesn't know his multiplication tables) and putting things in order (such as speaking - you have to put phonemes, words, sentences together in order to speak). But, he doesn't look like he has a disability and he doesn't speak much so people don't readily realize he doesn't talk lik…

Welders in my area can make > 100k easy. Houston area. Lots of work, not enough qualified welders.

Think you underestimate the certification requirements for welders. A simple welder certificate holder does need basic math skills. Required classes may include advanced mathematics, metallurgy, blueprint reading, welding symbols, pipe layout and a welding practicum.

http://study.com/welding_education.html

If the OP's child can not multiply, or follow ordered operations, it may be a huge stretch to to follow welding step-by-step assembly instructions.

The higher level welding certifications have chemistry and physics knowledge requirements.

http://www.aws.org/library/doclib/CWEng-bok.pdf

Source: Dad welds and has attempted to teach me. Only marginally interested :)

Re: Young White America Is Haunted by a Crisis of Despair

#316

Post by Touche »

throwanem wrote: post #305
Atheros wrote: post #297

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He almost certainly understands that. But he is saying that he wants data that demonstrates that the economic hardship causes the depression rather than drug use causing the depression. Obviously these causes are all intertwined but I think he's saying that it probably isn't particularly unidirectional. "The man in this article was already an addict before he was old enough to have any perspective on his future poten…

FTA, my emphases: > Johnson started using opioids in high school after breaking his collarbone, first in football and again while wrestling, and he got hooked on his prescription, his mother thinks . He was a functional addict at first, caring and warm, but things slipped out of control after he graduated and found that his skills—art and cooking, but not academics—meant little in the workforce . In Arnade's formulat…

What I was trying to say is that it's more complex than the article paints it. Certainly despair, and economic despair in particular, is at the heart of many of societies problems, drugs included.

But it's not necessarily the one in despair that turned to drugs. It might be his/her kids, who grew up without a supportive family (or perhaps were abused) when then found friends who accepted them, who turned them on to drugs. I mean, drug stats are what they are, more than 50% start before their 18.

Re: Young White America Is Haunted by a Crisis of Despair

#317

Post by magic_beans »

iamacynic wrote: post #279
magic_beans wrote: post #257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly, I assumed he was white because it was entirely unremarkable for a black person your grandfather's age to be illiterate or close to it. (I know your grandpa isn't black). An illiterate black person had almost no chance to have a successful life. > If you have confidence, charm, and enterprising spirit, the world is open despite any particular individual limitations. THAT is white privilege. You must understa…

why do you keep saying white privilege when you keep meaning black disadvantage? clearly this is not the same thing.

Are you actually serious? Why do you think black people are so disadvantaged? Who wins out in society then? White people.

Re: Young White America Is Haunted by a Crisis of Despair

#318

Post by LyndsySimon »

posguy wrote: post #212
_rpd wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and it is quite practical. It would be brutal. Very few would be able to get credit, and those that could would come under constant pressure to liquidate assets. > land is pooled and redivided If the government tried to seize and redistribute private land, there would be civil war. I think we have different definitions of practical.

Wiping away your debts wouldn't horribly destroy the credit bureaus, and short of the 1% rising up I doubt there would be civil war. Lending did not stop in ancient palestine due to Jubilee, if anything it provided a pressure relief in the form of a second chance where everyone was equalized in assets. Circling back to an uprising by the 1%, I'd be impressed if there weren't sufficient people ready to quell the rebel…

> Wiping away your debts wouldn't horribly destroy the credit bureaus, and short of the 1% rising up I doubt there would be civil war

I don't believe you have a full understanding of American society, particularly in the rural areas of the country.

Re: Young White America Is Haunted by a Crisis of Despair

#319

Post by wcummings »

jnicholasp wrote: post #286
wcummings wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's because it's hard to unionize retail. Manufacturing is nearly synonymous with union jobs in this context.

Why is it hard to unionize retail? My (naive) guess would be that retail is a less-skilled job, so attempts by labor-groups to make themselves a controlled source of labor supply are easily circumvented by the readiness with which those jobs can be filled by nearly anyone. Whereas manufacturing jobs that involve some degree of skill are more able to corner the market on their own labor, and thus better able to negoti…

A few notions, in order from what I think is most likely/important to least:

1. Retail involves large numbers of part-time workers, making the workforce harder to organize.

2. An idle factory is incredibly costly to the owners. Factory workers have more leverage.

3. Employer hostility/union breaking efforts, you need only spend a few minutes on google to find some nasty stories about wally world or your least favorite retail chain.

4. Lack of identity: if the last few years have taught us anything, it should be that people in manufacturing clearly have integrated their jobs into their identity. You can see programmers et al doing the same thing right here on HN every day. I doubt most people in retail consider "working in retail" to be an important part of who they are in the same way factory workers or programmers might.

5. Men ("breadwinners") have historically worked in manufacturing and women have historically worked in retail, lack of focus on retail historically by organizers

A more interesting question that "Why is it hard to unionize retail?" is "Why is it hard to unionize programmers?" I don't have as many good answers for that one. #3 is the only one which applies to programmers.

Re: Young White America Is Haunted by a Crisis of Despair

#320

Post by throwanem »

Touche wrote: post #316
throwanem wrote: post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FTA, my emphases: > Johnson started using opioids in high school after breaking his collarbone, first in football and again while wrestling, and he got hooked on his prescription, his mother thinks . He was a functional addict at first, caring and warm, but things slipped out of control after he graduated and found that his skills—art and cooking, but not academics—meant little in the workforce . In Arnade's formulat…

What I was trying to say is that it's more complex than the article paints it. Certainly despair, and economic despair in particular, is at the heart of many of societies problems, drugs included. But it's not necessarily the one in despair that turned to drugs. It might be his/her kids, who grew up without a supportive family (or perhaps were abused) when then found friends who accepted them, who turned them on to d…

I mean, maybe? Where are you trying to go with this?
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