Young White America Is Haunted by a Crisis of Despair • Hacker News Board

Re: Young White America Is Haunted by a Crisis of Despair

#141

Post by Animats » Wed, Apr 19, 2017, 5:25 PM UTC

From the article: “America is not a great place for people with only a high school degree, and I don’t think that’s going to get better anytime soon."

That's it. It just doesn't take that many people to make all the stuff. Erie, PA isn't going to come back.

The mantra used to be that people would be employed in "services". But services are more automated, too. Services done at some fixed location are rapidly being automated. Mobile services, too. Some recent developments:

* Stock picking in an Amazon warehouse - robots taking over. [1]

* Doordash delivery - robots now deployed in Redwood City. I've seen one in the downtown area. People just ignore them as they roll along the sidewalks. Their active six-wheel suspension can climb a curb. [2] There's an experimental partnership with Mercedes where a self-driving van holds multiple robots and lets them out for deliveries.

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14062360

[2] http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x5g2a2g_a-robot-that-delive...

Re: Young White America Is Haunted by a Crisis of Despair

#142

Post by magic_beans » Wed, Apr 19, 2017, 5:26 PM UTC

ModernMech wrote: post #80

ryandrake wrote: post #4

> The fates of the less-educated and those who graduate from universities diverge in dire ways. Middle-aged white Americans without four-year degrees are at increasing risk of dying, a well-documented trend driven not only by drug use but also by alcoholism, suicide, and slowing progress against heart disease and cancer. While that's pretty damn horrible, the fate of people with newly-minted bachelor's degrees isn't…

> unless you happened to major in the few areas of study where gainful employment is possible. Crushing student debt, high cost of living cities, an unreachably inflated housing market, low (but non-zero for now) job prospects Very much this. I came out of a good school with only $30k in debt and a degree in a tech field. My wife came out of an okay state school with $60k in debt (much of that private loans with high…

Many of my friends from high school went on to do undergrad, and then master's degrees in Art History. One of them is working as an intern at the Met now. The other three are living on their trust funds.

I don't understand why any sensible person would get an MA in the humanities. It's all well and good if you are doing for your own intellectual curiosity, but it's not so great if you expect a living wage on that degree. :(

Re: Young White America Is Haunted by a Crisis of Despair

#143

Post by cmahler7 » Wed, Apr 19, 2017, 5:26 PM UTC

okreallywtf wrote: post #108

cmahler7 wrote: post #35

We're at the point where the United State can either become utopia or dystopia. Automation can either allow everyone to do whatever they want with almost unlimited leisure, or continue as it has destroying the middle class and consolidating wealth for the elite. I used to be hardcore capitalism but if something isn't done to spread the wealth we are going to have our own French revolution with the plebes rising up ag…

I agree with you, but unfortunately the elites will be the last to suffer. They have been quite effective in blaming the victim for years and will continue to blame immigrants, pc-culture, mexico, regulations and any number of manufactured boogeymen. Once immigrants have been stomped down, minority rights done away with and the environment wrecked maybe people will turn on the elites but by that time we won't have mu…

I think this is why the media focuses so much on race and democrat vs republican. Divide and conquer. Keep the people at each others throats instead of at the people who are actually responsible

Re: Young White America Is Haunted by a Crisis of Despair

#144

Post by [deleted] » Wed, Apr 19, 2017, 5:26 PM UTC

Steuard wrote: post #120

temp246810 wrote: post #12

The sad thing that I've observed is that any mention that this gets in the media or any earnest attempt to address this gets met with: "Oh now that it's white people dealing with drugs, it's a crisis. America is so racist". That's a load of crap on so many levels. I hope we figure out our next chapter here as a society.

I think that the despair that people in these situations are facing is terrible and destructive and yes, a crisis. We need to find some way as a society to address the deep structural issues that has created this malaise. It's a really big deal. But... can you explain why it's a load of crap to point out that this crisis of despair and drugs and early death is being treated differently than previous ones that mostly…

[deleted]

Re: Young White America Is Haunted by a Crisis of Despair

#145

Post by bigmanwalter » Wed, Apr 19, 2017, 5:27 PM UTC

gramstrong wrote: post #75

cmahler7 wrote: post #35

We're at the point where the United State can either become utopia or dystopia. Automation can either allow everyone to do whatever they want with almost unlimited leisure, or continue as it has destroying the middle class and consolidating wealth for the elite. I used to be hardcore capitalism but if something isn't done to spread the wealth we are going to have our own French revolution with the plebes rising up ag…

>Automation can either allow everyone to do whatever they want with almost unlimited leisure This will literally never happen. The labor force will look a lot different, the average person will be much more educated. But we are never going to be in a perpetual state of leisure, or anything resembling it, lest we want to halt human progress in place. All automation does is allow us to focus on larger problems, or crea…

Why would basic research stop? It's mostly driven by government grants anyway.

Re: Young White America Is Haunted by a Crisis of Despair

#146

Post by Retric » Wed, Apr 19, 2017, 5:27 PM UTC

irrational wrote: post #6

I worry about this for my oldest son. He has dyspraxia and apraxia. In practice that means he has difficulty with memory (at 15 he still doesn't know his multiplication tables) and putting things in order (such as speaking - you have to put phonemes, words, sentences together in order to speak). But, he doesn't look like he has a disability and he doesn't speak much so people don't readily realize he doesn't talk lik…

Many collages will make accommodations for people with learning disabilities. However, I think he needs to have a longer term plan than just going to school. He needs to gain a skill that will provide gainful employment and collage is often not the right path for that.

Re: Young White America Is Haunted by a Crisis of Despair

#147

Post by anigbrowl » Wed, Apr 19, 2017, 5:28 PM UTC

dkhenry wrote: post #41

cpayne624 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think they specify 'White' based on this passage: "While blacks and Hispanics without college degrees are also falling behind economically and socially, middle-age mortality has worsened for whites in particular over the past 20 years—a fact some attribute partly to social context. “For whites, their reference group is previous generations of whites,” said Shannon Monnat, a Pennsylvania State University professor w…

Its previous generations non college educated whites who are previously lived in rural areas which better job prospects then today. The fact that the mortality gab is closing is nothing to do with race and more to do with economics. Showing that race isn't the factor, but the reporting instead focuses on race like this is some kind of white person problem. All we are seeing is the economic collapse that hit inner cit…

It has to do with race in that racial privilege used to have a higher economic premium than it does now. It would be facile toignore this fact; economics isn't some indepedent objective force, but the product of social and structural factors that are ultimately arbitrary.

I'm a big fan of Colin Woodard's book American Nations, which examines the very different social, economic and cultural assumptions of 11 different regions in the USA and goes a long way towards explaining the various frictions that arise from conflicting worldviews.

Re: Young White America Is Haunted by a Crisis of Despair

#148

Post by anigbrowl » Wed, Apr 19, 2017, 5:29 PM UTC

analyst74 wrote: post #27

pjmorris wrote: post #9

I think you could strike 'Young' and 'White' from the title, and it'd still be accurate.

An interesting thing I noticed after moving to America, is that race is such a big deal here that many issues have to be labeled by race, even if they apply universally. Canadian medias on the other hand, seem to be much less interested in playing the race card.

'Playing the race card' often comes off as code for saying 'racial issues aren't real.' Are you sure that you're not overlooking significant structural factors just because Canada has less racial tension than the USA does?

Re: Young White America Is Haunted by a Crisis of Despair

#149

Post by Stryder » Wed, Apr 19, 2017, 5:29 PM UTC

magic_beans wrote: post #134

_pmf_ wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The anger that got trump elected is just the beginning if things don't change Try to get a single Democrat to acknowledge this. They are still belitteling and stigmatizing those who share these concerns (and riduculing them for their audacity of hoping that Trump will be able to change anything).

I'm a Democrat (or a bleeding-heart liberal if you will). I completely understand why people voted for Trump. I'm simply puzzled as to why many of the poor folks who voted for him would do so, as his election is clearly not going to help anyone who isn't in his tax bracket.

Because an obviously incompetent hustler feels like the lesser of two evils compared to a well qualified snake who's secretly stabbing you in the back.

Not saying it's rational, or correct, or wise. Just saying that I'm pretty sure that's how people feel.

Re: Young White America Is Haunted by a Crisis of Despair

#150

Post by posguy » Wed, Apr 19, 2017, 5:30 PM UTC

sgift wrote: post #126

dorgo wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a programmer in Germany I don't even get half of that. Where can I sign?

Depending on the region and your experience you may consider asking for a raise or changing your job. You are probably (seriously) underpaid.

Pay in Germany is generally low. Where someone in Seattle would earn $120k to $140k easily, the same person in Germany may net only $40k to $50k. Housing and especially food & drink are much cheaper than the US though, $12 beers aren't anywhere near as common.