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Whistleblower uncovers London police hacking of journalists and protestors

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Re: Whistleblower uncovers London police hacking of journalists and protestors

#221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The same civil rights movements that got a bunch of laws put on books barring discrimination? The same laws which have been proven to be ignored time and again by law enforcement? You say that like the current situation is no better than what came before the civil rights movement.

You say that like the current situation doesn't still garner a lot of attention.

What?

Re: Whistleblower uncovers London police hacking of journalists and protestors

#222
post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You mean, like an election?

Lol that an election in the UK will change the direction of the country in terms of civil liberties. No one with a remote chance of winning will do that. (and the upcoming election send like it will just give Theresa May a free hand to do what she wants)

Perhaps that's because most of the electorate think recent governments have struck a good balance between civil liberties and security.

I happen to believe that trade off has gone a bit far and I'm worried that significant further erosion of civil liberties would start causing some serious issues, but lets face it if we believe that we have to argue the case before the public. Whining about living in a police state isn't going to be very productive, or lend that struggle much credibility.

Re: Whistleblower uncovers London police hacking of journalists and protestors

#223
post #202

V for Vendetta was supposed to be a cautionary tale, not a manual or goalpost. Britain really has gone to shit. Probably one of the last countries I'd want to move to.

Agreed, I am British and got out just before the full power of the Conservatives was realised. I would not plan on going back any time soon, I'm sure I'm not a minority in thinking this.

I'm British and I'm scared I'm going to be worse off staying in Britain - how did you come to be able to leave?

Re: Whistleblower uncovers London police hacking of journalists and protestors

#224
post #178

>> This alleged criminality is the result of a deliberate government policy of using the police and security services to [...] protect company profits and the status quo. [...] it is not simply the case that the police and security services are just being used by the government. In fact, the police and security services are becoming emboldened to take a more independent role as direct agencies of the ruling elite, ov…

> No comments needed Except that, you know, not sure how impartial the World Socialist Web Site is likely to be!!

Do you have any specific criticisms of the partiality of the story, or are you just throwing bombs?

Who is your favorite "impartial" reporter? Publication?

Re: Whistleblower uncovers London police hacking of journalists and protestors

#225
post #178

>> This alleged criminality is the result of a deliberate government policy of using the police and security services to [...] protect company profits and the status quo. [...] it is not simply the case that the police and security services are just being used by the government. In fact, the police and security services are becoming emboldened to take a more independent role as direct agencies of the ruling elite, ov…

> No comments needed Except that, you know, not sure how impartial the World Socialist Web Site is likely to be!!

Impartial or not: let's count the MSM-sources that do not report on this matter; or only report late (because it would otherwise become weird if they wouldn't).

I did not see this yet in any of the MSM sites I sometimes poll on these matters. Nothing yet! If this news if true, which I believe at this point, then it is a BIG story (proven total failure of democracy, high up officials in charge have to step down because of protests). Here on HN we seem to generally agree that it is a big story as it is on the front page for quite some hours.

Re: Whistleblower uncovers London police hacking of journalists and protestors

#226
post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, at the very least, "the sixth was nearly a match" is pretty damning. "Nono, you've got it wrong, MY password is hunterTHREE - you see there was this incident..."

I'm gonna continue to play Devils advocate here and that person in question could of merely confirmed that it was close. But realistically I think your right. People will gladly handout passwords to people who sound authoritative. It's amazing to me how many DEFCON talks begin with: "So we just pretended to be X and asked for their password and got it."

OT: I see you've used "could of" multiple times. Just wanted to say it's "could have". Cheers.

Re: Whistleblower uncovers London police hacking of journalists and protestors

#227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure the German justice goes after people making unlawful postings and entire specialized police units are being established. Charges and successful verdicts regarding internet posts are nothing new at all. However, going after the posters (and even just identifying them) takes a long time. Much to long compared to the speed postings get shared.

It's not the German justice going after it, that's the point. Why would they? They're not looking to punish anyone, but simply make unwanted statements disappear. Right now, they've appointed a private organization (Arvato) that belongs to the Bertelsmann group, which has a strong lobbying branch and is very close to the government. So basically, a private corporation is allowed to run its own show on all ends and it…

How do you explain the countless penalty orders and verdicts over internet posts that were issued in the last thirty years then? People were punished for internet posts that are against the law and will continue to be punished for internet posts.

Arvato was contracted by Facebook to enforce their own terms of service and comply with the law. They are free to contract any company they like to operate on their platform. It's not the government that chose Arvato.

If you think that law is the result of lobbying alone you haven't followed to large public debate that happened over this topic the last year at all.

And please refrain from name-calling. This doesn't make your arguments look any better.

Re: Whistleblower uncovers London police hacking of journalists and protestors

#228
post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is partly why I am an anarcho-Communist, in favour of decentralised planning or to a lesser extent market Socialism. I'm not sure what to do about giving the vote to people; arguably democracy is very good, but I would rather have per-commune direct democracy (with instantly recallable delegates or without) rather than a representative democracy. In short, I want to do away with voting for masters, as it will be…

> This is partly why I am an anarcho-Communist You believe in an oxymoron?

Anarcho-Communism is not an oxymoron; Communism is by definition a stateless and indeed classless society, as described by Marx and Engels.

Re: Whistleblower uncovers London police hacking of journalists and protestors

#229
post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given how easy a group can be swayed and controlled given our current centralization of media/culture, our technology, and our understanding of psychology, is it possible for there to ever again be a people's democracy? Giving the vote to the people seems to be inherently giving the vote to those who control the information being fed to the people, be that an oligarchy or the government.

This is partly why I am an anarcho-Communist, in favour of decentralised planning or to a lesser extent market Socialism. I'm not sure what to do about giving the vote to people; arguably democracy is very good, but I would rather have per-commune direct democracy (with instantly recallable delegates or without) rather than a representative democracy. In short, I want to do away with voting for masters, as it will be…

Please don't take discussions further into general ideological territory. This rarely begets good discussion and is strongly discouraged on HN.

Re: Whistleblower uncovers London police hacking of journalists and protestors

#230
post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is partly why I am an anarcho-Communist, in favour of decentralised planning or to a lesser extent market Socialism. I'm not sure what to do about giving the vote to people; arguably democracy is very good, but I would rather have per-commune direct democracy (with instantly recallable delegates or without) rather than a representative democracy. In short, I want to do away with voting for masters, as it will be…

> This is partly why I am an anarcho-Communist You believe in an oxymoron?

Anarcho-Communism isn't an oxymoron; people often (because Lenin) confuse Communism as an ideology with the practices of certain regimes which notionally were oriented toward achieving Communism (but never progressed beyond the phase they described as Socialism, which is distinct from Communism) and which leftist critics (including, among others, non-Leninist Marxists and other socialists) described as not even that, but State Capitalism.

In Marxist Communism (and, with variations that are important but not relevant to this discussion, it's derivatives through Leninism), "Communism" is the desired stateless end-state, and the "dictatorship of the proletariat" in which the workers seize control of the means of production through the State—Socialism—is a transitional stage used to get from Capitalism to Communism.

Non-Marxist Communism seeks the same stateless end goal by other means; Anarcho-Communism is, in a sense, among the purest forms of Communism, since it seeks fairly direct (not necessarily immediate, but constsntly in the same direction and not the out-and-back "empower the State to destroy the State" approach) transition to the statelessend end-state.

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