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Facebook Announces React Fiber, a Rewrite of Its React Framework

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Re: Facebook Announces React Fiber, a Rewrite of Its React Framework

#191

Post by avodonosov »

paganel wrote: post #49
colordrops wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know about others but I tire of these comments chiding the "out of control" front-end ecosystem. The situation has already changed years ago. We aren't going to get off of your lawn while you continue to beat a dead horse. The web is built on open standards and there are billions of pages and apps out there. To expect web development to be a perfect monoculture is a failure of your imagination and ability to…

Not the OP, but I expect the web to be a thing where documents (i.e. mainly text) don't have any issues rendering on my 5-year old phone or on my 8-year laptop (both of which work very well, still, and which I don't plan to replace anytime soon). The recent web practices (I'm talking mostly of the last 2-3 years, since more and more people have started copying Twitter with its launch of its "every website needs to be…

I would love HN to provide an easy way to see where the reply thread to this first comment ends. Some js might enable that. Basic html/css - I think no.

Re: Facebook Announces React Fiber, a Rewrite of Its React Framework

#192

Post by [deleted] »

paganel wrote: post #49
colordrops wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know about others but I tire of these comments chiding the "out of control" front-end ecosystem. The situation has already changed years ago. We aren't going to get off of your lawn while you continue to beat a dead horse. The web is built on open standards and there are billions of pages and apps out there. To expect web development to be a perfect monoculture is a failure of your imagination and ability to…

Not the OP, but I expect the web to be a thing where documents (i.e. mainly text) don't have any issues rendering on my 5-year old phone or on my 8-year laptop (both of which work very well, still, and which I don't plan to replace anytime soon). The recent web practices (I'm talking mostly of the last 2-3 years, since more and more people have started copying Twitter with its launch of its "every website needs to be…

[deleted]

Re: Facebook Announces React Fiber, a Rewrite of Its React Framework

#193

Post by tuxracer »

red023 wrote: post #187

How does it compare with vue.js? I never worked with any modern JS framework like this but on paper I did not like writing CSS in javascript and vue.js had a normal way to write CSS and to me it looked superior in other ways as well.

Taking it even further https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERB1TJBn32c#t=1m45s

Re: Facebook Announces React Fiber, a Rewrite of Its React Framework

#194

Post by julian_1 »

segphault wrote: post #101
dntrkv wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Browsers and JavaScript are what we have, we can't magically replace every browser and JS implementation in the world. We have to figure out where we want to go and slowly get there. That is exactly what is happening in the frontend world and that is why there is so much churn. Browser apps have to work across 4 major browsers with versions going back almost 10 years, an infinite amount of screen sizes, and a near in…

> And the other great thing about these tools is you can add/remove them as needed. In order to get that freedom, you need to build the tooling in such a way that it aligns with the web standards, so that when the standards catch up you can drop what you don't actually need anymore. We all switched from coffescript to ES6 and Babel because ES6, being standards-based, will eventually be supported in browsers, right? A…

> And yet, with JSX we have a gratuitously non-standard dialect of JavaScript that isn't on the standards track and will never be natively supported in browsers.

It just gets compiled down to native javascript. JSX is also optional in React - meaning that you don't have to use it. And having an actual client-side data-structure to represent DOM is arguably better than using string based templates which is what folks have been using for decades.

Also, compilation is not a dirty word - when you consider just how primitive the standard language is. A static type-checking compilation pass also helps keep large codebases/modules manageable, and aids refactoring by being able to catch errors - without actually having to run the code to figure out what it does.

It's true that there is unnecessary fragmentation. But the broad trend reveals that front-end development is actually starting to catch up with best-practice.

Re: Facebook Announces React Fiber, a Rewrite of Its React Framework

#195

Post by mattnewton »

quadrupleslap wrote: post #130
mattnewton wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Monocultures develop because of corporate backing. The web being open and unclaimed is what leads to the great diversity. As someone who does both server and JavaScript development, the tools are not bad. Often times they solve real problems well.

That's silly - if anything it's the other way around. Web tools have a ridiculous degree of corporate backing, especially with the countless libraries from Facebook and Google (React, Angular, Go, Dart, Flow, IMMUTABLE, etc.), and even Microsoft with TypeScript and others. Meanwhile, Make and friends don't have any corporate backing.

None of them can lay claim to the web though, contrasted with other ui platforms like windows, ios, etc.

Re: Facebook Announces React Fiber, a Rewrite of Its React Framework

#196

Post by franzwong »

paganel wrote: post #49
colordrops wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know about others but I tire of these comments chiding the "out of control" front-end ecosystem. The situation has already changed years ago. We aren't going to get off of your lawn while you continue to beat a dead horse. The web is built on open standards and there are billions of pages and apps out there. To expect web development to be a perfect monoculture is a failure of your imagination and ability to…

Not the OP, but I expect the web to be a thing where documents (i.e. mainly text) don't have any issues rendering on my 5-year old phone or on my 8-year laptop (both of which work very well, still, and which I don't plan to replace anytime soon). The recent web practices (I'm talking mostly of the last 2-3 years, since more and more people have started copying Twitter with its launch of its "every website needs to be…

But I seldom hear people saying the old web pages can't be shown on today's browser.

Re: Facebook Announces React Fiber, a Rewrite of Its React Framework

#197

Post by madeofpalk »

paganel wrote: post #49
colordrops wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know about others but I tire of these comments chiding the "out of control" front-end ecosystem. The situation has already changed years ago. We aren't going to get off of your lawn while you continue to beat a dead horse. The web is built on open standards and there are billions of pages and apps out there. To expect web development to be a perfect monoculture is a failure of your imagination and ability to…

Not the OP, but I expect the web to be a thing where documents (i.e. mainly text) don't have any issues rendering on my 5-year old phone or on my 8-year laptop (both of which work very well, still, and which I don't plan to replace anytime soon). The recent web practices (I'm talking mostly of the last 2-3 years, since more and more people have started copying Twitter with its launch of its "every website needs to be…

That is a vision that is incompatible with the reality of computing from the past 10 years.

Re: Facebook Announces React Fiber, a Rewrite of Its React Framework

#198

Post by andrewingram »

segphault wrote: post #154
ng12 wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was never intended to be supported natively by browsers -- it's syntactic sugar for the React.createElement API. That's what I mean when I say JSX is Javascript. That issue you linked to is 4 years old and is clearly a reflection of the poster being unfamiliar with React/JSX. The community has since unambiguously decided to avoid inserting more control flow in JSX. Also, I'm not entirely sure what the do/while plu…

> That issue you linked to is 4 years old and is clearly a reflection of the poster being unfamiliar with React/JSX And yet the underlying issues still remain unaddressed. There aren't better ways to handle the cases raised in that issue, which is why people resort to adding additional non-standard syntax to work around the warts. > Also, I'm not entirely sure what the do/while plugin has to do with JSX. The "do" key…

Last I heard (from a twitter thread with those in the know), the "do" keyword is considered highly likely to become standard.

Re: Facebook Announces React Fiber, a Rewrite of Its React Framework

#199

Post by julian_1 »

nightski wrote: post #50
acemarke wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your comment seems to be a bit of a non-sequitur. Application development is complex, period. Posix development is complicated. Qt is big and complicated. Makefiles are complicated. Autotools is complicated. Big Java server apps are complicated. C++ is complicated. We've just hit the point where people are trying to do the same thing in a browser. Would you prefer to build your application using Make, Scons, Waf, CMa…

The benefits you acknowledge (distribution) are not because of the tech but in spite of it. At the end of the day all it would take is one of the 3 major browser vendors to offer an alternative. That alternative could be distributed to a large percentage of desktops in a relatively quick manner saving billions if not trillions of dollars in wasted productivity. It will never happen though. * EDIT: This comes from som…

No-one could even agree on making HTML5 valid XML - in order to leverage all the tools and knowledge that exist in that space.

Not that I even like XML. But having another XML dialect that's not actual XML shows that the only hope is to build valid tools and abstractions on top of all the crud.

Re: Facebook Announces React Fiber, a Rewrite of Its React Framework

#200

Post by mod »

rocky1138 wrote: post #178
mod wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who has worked on a truly large React project, I can assure you this is not true. I cannot imagine the shitshow that project would be using jQuery to track the state. Nearly as soon as you progress from 'backend rendering html' to single-page-app, it behooves you to use React.

What's the major advantage of moving from "backend rendering html" to single-page-app?

There are trade-offs. In very broad terms, single-page-apps are better for something that behaves more like an application (has a lot of user interaction or real-time behavior) than something that behaves more like a website (a page is loaded and the user views that now-static page for a period of time).

I try to fit the more traditional paradigm when I'm allowed to architect an app myself. I like rendering a page on the backend.

Anyway, you can read arguments by smarter people than myself: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/21862054/single-page-appl...

That's just one thread of many.

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