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Filing Taxes in Japan Is a Breeze. Why Not in the US?

nytimes.com

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Re: Filing Taxes in Japan Is a Breeze. Why Not in the US?

#271

Post by thro1237 »

sqeaky wrote: post #182
Waterluvian wrote: post #128

I don't have the most complex tax situation: a wife, child, income, capital gains. But it takes me maybe 15 minutes in Canada to do. I once screwed it up and they fixed it for me, yielding a larger return than I calculated (I accidentally zeroed the RRSP contribution carry over value). Thought maybe this would help give perspective of what can be.

Is there anything Canada isn't best at? I once heard a (bad) joke. If you are in Canada and hold the door for a group of 5 people you can expect 7 "thank you"s. Well that's just a joke I thought, there is no way people are polite anywhere. So I decided to act on this little limerick and compare it to Nebraska manners. At a few restaurants, in home town of Omaha, I tried holding the door for groups counting the "thank…

Now, that is a good joke

Re: Filing Taxes in Japan Is a Breeze. Why Not in the US?

#272

Post by gadders »

Angostura wrote: post #169
patio11 wrote: post #50

The NTA (National Tax Authority, cited as the Kokuzeicho in the article) doesn't figure out your taxes for you. Your employer does, as one of the (many!) ways in which they exercise paternalistic control of your life. If you do not have an employer, you get to go through a process which is almost exactly as fun as it is in the US, modulo a modestly competent online filing application. I spent $3k this year on account…

In the U.K. If you are employed, your tax is worked out for your through the Pay as You Earn system. If you are self employed you fill in the rather good self-assessment form online and your tax is calculated for you.

Most self-employed IT Contractors I know all have accountants.

Re: Filing Taxes in Japan Is a Breeze. Why Not in the US?

#273

Post by mercutio2 »

sokoloff wrote: post #264
mercutio2 wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He didn't say arithmetic error, he said miscalculated basis. Very different. Here's how it happens to lots of people. 1. Vest RSUs worth $25k-500k, depending on how senior you are and what BigCo you work for 2. Employer sells 40% of your shares instantly upon vesting, for taxes 3. Employer remits that 40% to the government 4. You sell all your shares, because you realize concentrating your risk of investment loss wit…

That's exactly the mechanism of my error, although I seem to recall the amount in question was more like $125-150K of basis miscalculated. (I crisply recall that it was a $29K refund from the amendment.) That did represent multiple years of vested RSUs which I sold all in one year to make the downpayment on our house; some of them I had filed as short-term gains, others as long-term gains, all against a $0 basis. (I…

Sorry this bit you.

150k of miscalculated basis would be about 250k of pre-tax RSUs, which is the ballpark I was vaguely thinking of.

Re: Filing Taxes in Japan Is a Breeze. Why Not in the US?

#274

Post by mnm1 »

raarts wrote: post #183
mnm1 wrote: post #175

All other developed countries have no problem doing ________. Why can't the US do _________? Lobbying. Works for simple tax returns, healthcare, labor laws, unionizing, etc.

Banking and payment systems are arcane too. Nobody uses checks any more except the US, and online banking is soooo complicated and confusing completed to other Western countries.

Yup. Not only that, but checks are still the most secure, most convenient, easiest way to transfer money in the US despite things like ACH. Banks are still not required to implement proper online security by law and are generally the most insecure sites one visits on the web. Not all our problems are due to lobbying/legal corruption, but most are and therefore most have simple solutions. Sad.

Re: Filing Taxes in Japan Is a Breeze. Why Not in the US?

#275

Post by desas »

lutorm wrote: post #262
desas wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't Americans get pay slips which state how much they earned gross, how much tax & social security they paid (in dollars) and much they earned net?

Yes but that's just how much is withheld, not your final tax amount.

For most Brits, most of the time they're one and the same - the taxman will tell your employer your tax code (= your tax free amount) and it's usually the same offset from standard each year. From this thread it appears that American taxes have more complicated rules.

Re: Filing Taxes in Japan Is a Breeze. Why Not in the US?

#276

Post by sokoloff »

mercutio2 wrote: post #273
sokoloff wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's exactly the mechanism of my error, although I seem to recall the amount in question was more like $125-150K of basis miscalculated. (I crisply recall that it was a $29K refund from the amendment.) That did represent multiple years of vested RSUs which I sold all in one year to make the downpayment on our house; some of them I had filed as short-term gains, others as long-term gains, all against a $0 basis. (I…

Sorry this bit you. 150k of miscalculated basis would be about 250k of pre-tax RSUs, which is the ballpark I was vaguely thinking of.

A $29K error would be over $200K of pre-tax RSUs. I had to work it out in Sheets to be sure as the number was higher than I thought (and definitely in the ballpark of your figure, so this is a "you're right" reply not a "no, but" reply.

I assumed in Sheets (arbitrarily) one grant, 10% CAGR on share price, annual vesting, and selling the whole grant in year 4 (so years 1-3 growth are LTCG and year 4 is no growth after vest).

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1zY4DUwid_syt1bdCvvkc...

Re: Filing Taxes in Japan Is a Breeze. Why Not in the US?

#277

Post by anuraaga »

outside1234 wrote: post #173
patio11 wrote: post #50

The NTA (National Tax Authority, cited as the Kokuzeicho in the article) doesn't figure out your taxes for you. Your employer does, as one of the (many!) ways in which they exercise paternalistic control of your life. If you do not have an employer, you get to go through a process which is almost exactly as fun as it is in the US, modulo a modestly competent online filing application. I spent $3k this year on account…

How does your employer compute your taxes without knowing your outside income in interest, dividends, etc? Or do you have to share that with your employer in Japan?

Japanese securities companies have special accounts which automatically report tax-related information to the tax agency and withdraw taxes appropriately. So you'd be able to do standard stock and currency trading without being required to file a return. It's quite nice being able to work at a company and participate in the market, and still not have to worry about filing.

Doing rarer activities such as investing in startups brings you into return-filing territory though, but I guess that's unavoidable since it's private investing, and not a concern for most people. Reading many comments on this post, it's clear hackers generally aren't "most people" ;)

Re: Filing Taxes in Japan Is a Breeze. Why Not in the US?

#278

Post by sqeaky »

thro1237 wrote: post #271
sqeaky wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there anything Canada isn't best at? I once heard a (bad) joke. If you are in Canada and hold the door for a group of 5 people you can expect 7 "thank you"s. Well that's just a joke I thought, there is no way people are polite anywhere. So I decided to act on this little limerick and compare it to Nebraska manners. At a few restaurants, in home town of Omaha, I tried holding the door for groups counting the "thank…

Now, that is a good joke

Thank you, Thank you.

Re: Filing Taxes in Japan Is a Breeze. Why Not in the US?

#279

Post by mixmastamyk »

cjhanks wrote: post #151
eloisant wrote: post #54

It's a breeze in France too. Login to the government website, verify that everything preloaded is correct, add the few things they don't know about and you're done. It's a mess in the US because Turbotax and others make money on that complexity and do lobbying to keep it that way.

I am not sure I get it... it took me less than 2 hours to enter my W2's, import my brokerage liabilities, and insert my itemized deductions. All for about $60. You know what would be worse than that? A system which has absolutely no competition or financial incentive to improve....

Bullshit. There is no reason to enter it---they already know almost everything. Just add to it if necessary.

There is no reason to pay a third party.

There is no reason to get a third party involved in your private financial matters, just another place to get hacked.

And just because it was tolerable for you, doesn't mean that's average. My taxes took four days and about eight pages, and I didn't make much last year.

Again they already know all this shit.

I filed taxes in NZ a few years back and it was a hundred times easier, "next next finish," on a modern website. Took 15 minutes.

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