Princeton’s Ad-Blocker May Put an End to the Ad-Blocking Arms Race • Hacker News Board

Re: Princeton’s Ad-Blocker May Put an End to the Ad-Blocking Arms Race

#121

Post by unholythree » Fri, Apr 14, 2017, 9:05 PM UTC

wernercd wrote: post #61

randomwalker wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Coauthor of the paper here. No --- this is not one of the three techniques that we implemented. It was a hypothetical suggestion for future work. Unfortunate that the article didn't make that clear. Here is the paper http://randomwalker.info/publications/ad-blocking-framework-... Here is our blog post about it: https://freedom-to-tinker.com/2017/04/14/the-future-of-ad-bl...

Just a throw out question: One of the biggest issues (IMO) is the security threat... if there is a second copy that "we" don't see, doesn't that mean that the second copy can do "bad things" still? Case in Point: Forbes requests you disable ad-blocker... then serves pop-under malware: http://www.networkworld.com/article/3021113/security/forbes-... I could stomach ads - just like I stomached commercials on TV shows...…

This is what matters most to me. My dislike of ads are out of fear of malicious code first, tracking second, and wasting my bandwidth third.

The simple gif banner ads of yore were tolerable enough.

Re: Princeton’s Ad-Blocker May Put an End to the Ad-Blocking Arms Race

#122

Post by lern_too_spel » Fri, Apr 14, 2017, 9:06 PM UTC

rhizome wrote: post #39

polskibus wrote: post #30

This is a beginning of a new arms race, not an end. We'll now see an explosion of machine cheating and computer blinding techniques.

I guess look for salaries to explode in adtech.

If the overall effectiveness of Internet advertising decreases, the amount of money spent on adtech will decrease correspondingly.

Re: Princeton’s Ad-Blocker May Put an End to the Ad-Blocking Arms Race

#123

Post by skybrian » Fri, Apr 14, 2017, 9:06 PM UTC

downandout wrote: post #36

The article puts a significant emphasis on the idea that bulletproof ad-blocking technology, assuming that's what this turns out to be in practice, will work long-term becuase of legal restrictions imposed by the FTC. If Google, Facebook, or other multi-billion dollar entities detect an existential threat arising from this or any other technology, rest assured that the laws will change as quickly as is necessary to k…

This is too cynical. You can be sure there will be lobbyists involved making the case for companies affected, but this does not guarantee results. Any business plan where there's government involved is risky.

Heck, even with a Republican-controlled Congress, the Republicans can't always get their agenda passed because they don't even agree among themselves what it is.

Nobody can rest easy that Congress will do what they want.

Re: Princeton’s Ad-Blocker May Put an End to the Ad-Blocking Arms Race

#124

Post by derefr » Fri, Apr 14, 2017, 9:07 PM UTC

jpambrun wrote: post #60

downandout wrote: post #36

The article puts a significant emphasis on the idea that bulletproof ad-blocking technology, assuming that's what this turns out to be in practice, will work long-term becuase of legal restrictions imposed by the FTC. If Google, Facebook, or other multi-billion dollar entities detect an existential threat arising from this or any other technology, rest assured that the laws will change as quickly as is necessary to k…

Not sure Anti-ad-blocking laws are practically enforceable. Even with the ad labeling requirements relaxed, unless it is truly deceptive, a CNN could identify it just as well (or better) than we can.

I'm pretty sure that, if the ad is embedded into a platform that's locked up with DRM, then an ad-blocker developer would necessarily be violating DMCA provisions by publishing their work. It's thankful that no major PC or mobile OS is yet considered to fall under those regulations, but I think it would already apply in the case of game consoles.

Re: Princeton’s Ad-Blocker May Put an End to the Ad-Blocking Arms Race

#125

Post by gaag2 » Fri, Apr 14, 2017, 9:07 PM UTC

Ads are necessary for business!

Re: Princeton’s Ad-Blocker May Put an End to the Ad-Blocking Arms Race

#126

Post by jkoebler » Fri, Apr 14, 2017, 9:08 PM UTC

make3 wrote: post #75

Just change the alpha values in the `coverContainer` function in `utils.js` and it actually blocks ads. Patched `utils.js`: https://pastebin.com/YLyN2uJ8

Hey—I wrote this article ... if anyone forks this and makes it real please let me know. @jason_koebler on twitter or jason.koebler@vice.com

Re: Princeton’s Ad-Blocker May Put an End to the Ad-Blocking Arms Race

#127

Post by orblivion » Fri, Apr 14, 2017, 9:08 PM UTC

The war on ads is like the war on drugs. This is just going to create more ruthless ad cartels. There is a demand to be met, it will find its way to the consumer, even if it has to plow over 50 others in the process.

The question is, what is the online ad equivalent of legalizing drugs?

Re: Princeton’s Ad-Blocker May Put an End to the Ad-Blocking Arms Race

#128

Post by [deleted] » Fri, Apr 14, 2017, 9:08 PM UTC

make3 wrote: post #110

sauwan wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is probably obvious, but where is that file?

The chrome extension file (.crx) is a zip file (with meta data). Just unzip it and you'll find the files, including the 'utils.js'.

[deleted]

Re: Princeton’s Ad-Blocker May Put an End to the Ad-Blocking Arms Race

#129

Post by derefr » Fri, Apr 14, 2017, 9:11 PM UTC

Chaebixi wrote: post #93

jpambrun wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure Anti-ad-blocking laws are practically enforceable. Even with the ad labeling requirements relaxed, unless it is truly deceptive, a CNN could identify it just as well (or better) than we can.

> Not sure Anti-ad-blocking laws are practically enforceable An anti-ad-blocker ad would probably be easy to enforce: arrest the people making and distributing ad blockers. However, I think the main threat is a repeal of requirements to label ads (which this technology relies on), not to ban ad-blockers outright. I bet that would cause less resistance. Quoth the OP: > Perceptual ad-blocking, on the other hand, ignore…

You assume everyone who writes an ad-blocker lives in the US, or a in country the US has coerced into joining WIPO. If an ad-blocked is written by a Chinese citizen, hosted in a Russian data-center, and attached to an Iranian domain name, what precisely is the US government going to do?

Re: Princeton’s Ad-Blocker May Put an End to the Ad-Blocking Arms Race

#130

Post by quotemstr » Fri, Apr 14, 2017, 9:11 PM UTC

aub3bhat wrote: post #56

Wait they don't even have a fully working implementation, and yet VICE is already proclaiming it as an end of Ad-blocking wars? Color me skeptical. Now I know that the original authors did not write the clickbait headline or even the article, but working on Ad blocker is a poor use of resources. On a longer time horizon websites that cannot be supported via Ads will turn into Apps that require multiple permissions +…

These techniques also work fine in the mobile world, and they can be applied at the OS level, where apps can't observe that their graphical output is being manipulated.