United removes first-class passenger to make room for 'higher-priority' traveler • Hacker News Board

Re: United removes first-class passenger to make room for 'higher-priority' traveler

#301

Post by throwaway2048 » Thu, Apr 13, 2017, 3:44 PM UTC

talmand wrote: post #276

shamaku wrote: post #273

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're exactly the kind of people I worry about. Accepting idiotic rules without any critical diagnosis of the bigger picture, giving up your last ounce of humility in return for "security".

Hmm, I fail to see where my statement makes the claim I accept such idiotic rules. My statement makes the claim that it is stupid to act stupid in an effort to fight stupid rules. And then I agreed with the TSA security theater notion and bloated budget which goes against your thought I've given up my last ounce of humility in return for "security". I suggest you read my statement again because you clearly misunderst…

You tacitly accept rules you refuse to oppose or do anything about.

Re: United removes first-class passenger to make room for 'higher-priority' traveler

#302

Post by e40 » Thu, Apr 13, 2017, 3:46 PM UTC

imgabe wrote: post #281

jhulla wrote: post #248

Comment might be buried... But, the problem is the baroque overlaid combinations of [seat class, fare class, FF status, standby, cash vs FF purchase, time of arrival at gate, etc.] intersecting with [connecting flts, equipment, weather, etc.] leads to a large range of predictable conditions with uncertain outcomes. E.g. only one seat remaining, who gets it: passenger needing to make intl connection on a FF ticket or…

The other issue is to stop overbooking every single flight and allow some slack to handle these unexpected situations that inevitably come up.

They will never do that, since it impacts profit.

Re: United removes first-class passenger to make room for 'higher-priority' traveler

#303

Post by eCa » Thu, Apr 13, 2017, 3:47 PM UTC

davidf18 wrote: post #213

tyfon wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The company I work at (in Norway) had planed to take all 70 employees to NYC this summer to celebrate a milestone reached. We just moved the whole thing to Paris instead as we had issues with all of the above, including employees that have visited "dangerous" countries. The thing that pushed everyone over was when our former prime minster was harassed[1] at the border for having been to a meeting in Iran. It says in…

Well, I'm very sorry your employees missed out on visiting NYC. As a NYC resident and as someone who has been to Paris many times, Paris is very nice. But people that come to NYC have a much greater experience. In the past month I met both an Italian who came here for the first time and an Israeli and both of them were so happy to be here. I think your employer should schedule a trip to NYC for these 70 employees --…

> But people that come to NYC have a much greater experience.

That's quite a statement. I certainly enjoyed my NYC trip a couple of years ago, but there are many european cities that I rather (re)visit before going back to the US. This is not only because of the current administration (though that doesn't help). People have different preferences.

Re: United removes first-class passenger to make room for 'higher-priority' traveler

#304

Post by knownothing » Thu, Apr 13, 2017, 3:47 PM UTC

yodsanklai wrote: post #121

Klathmon wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anecdotally I've noticed that for like 5 years now my friends and family have a pretty severe aversion to flying anywhere for anything. From needing to show up hours before the flight, to the invasive screenings, the insane restrictions on what you can and cannot bring, the sentiment that if you check any baggage it's basically as good as gone, the ever increasing cost, the delays, and even things like the worry abou…

You're painting a darker picture than what it really is :) Most of the time, things go smoothly and flights are very affordable. I find it amazing that as a middle class person I can fly pretty much anywhere in the world. I can live with the inconvenience of being scolded by the TSA and US customs officers. Actually, I wonder how much this will last considering that fossil energy will likely cost more and more and th…

> Actually, I wonder how much this will last considering that fossil energy will likely cost more and more and that more and more people from developing countries start to travel too.

When I was flying back from Paris, I sat next to an Airbus engineer who was working on retrofitting jet engines to run on a biofuel produced via fermentation rather than normal fuel.

No clue how far along that project is or how promising it is, but there are folks in the industry thinking about this problem.

Re: United removes first-class passenger to make room for 'higher-priority' traveler

#305

Post by throwaway2048 » Thu, Apr 13, 2017, 3:47 PM UTC

_red wrote: post #137

Klathmon wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anecdotally I've noticed that for like 5 years now my friends and family have a pretty severe aversion to flying anywhere for anything. From needing to show up hours before the flight, to the invasive screenings, the insane restrictions on what you can and cannot bring, the sentiment that if you check any baggage it's basically as good as gone, the ever increasing cost, the delays, and even things like the worry abou…

IF the VLJ (Very Light Jet) segment would ever fully blossom a major Uber-style disruption would be possible. The biggest thing that could prevent this welcomed development? The government. Specifically that the FAA is likely to clamp down on "Uber Air Taxi" market and declare them common carriers. Got to protect those monopolies.

pilots not licensed for commerical people transport are forbidden from taking money to fly people places. Planes that do fly people places from money are either forced to use the TSA or provide "equivilent security".

Re: United removes first-class passenger to make room for 'higher-priority' traveler

#306

Post by modoc » Thu, Apr 13, 2017, 3:49 PM UTC

dragontamer wrote: post #287

imgabe wrote: post #281

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The other issue is to stop overbooking every single flight and allow some slack to handle these unexpected situations that inevitably come up.

Which means increased costs, especially since every other airline is also overbooking flights. Free-market is an asshole in this case: gotta overbook to compete.

AFAIK JetBlue doesn't overbook.

Re: United removes first-class passenger to make room for 'higher-priority' traveler

#307

Post by anovikov » Thu, Apr 13, 2017, 3:50 PM UTC

e40 wrote: post #302

imgabe wrote: post #281

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The other issue is to stop overbooking every single flight and allow some slack to handle these unexpected situations that inevitably come up.

They will never do that, since it impacts profit.

Due to airlines' razor thin margins, this is simply impossible. That simple. Every single traditional airline will go bankrupt if it stopped overbooking.

Unfortunately it is the greed and stupidity of us consumers that drove this market into the ground. We shouldn't blame airlines. Think about this next time when you pick 'order by price' in skyscanner...

Re: United removes first-class passenger to make room for 'higher-priority' traveler

#308

Post by throwaway2048 » Thu, Apr 13, 2017, 3:50 PM UTC

RightMillennial wrote: post #240

Cthulhu_ wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is driving really cheaper? I mean I'm pretty sure the margins are pretty thin, if it's just you at least - they should balance out the more people you need to transport. Mind you I'm from Europe, our gas prices are 4x as high and for trips to e.g. the UK or Scandinavia we have to cross a body of water. There's some toll roads too in e.g. France, and Germany wants to introduce those too.

It really depends on the location of departure, destination, and how valuable your time is. For example, I can fly round trip from Chicago, IL (ORD) to Miami, FL (MIA) for $325 per person (tax included, no checked luggage) taking about 7 hours each way (45 minutes to airport, arrive 2 hours early, 3:15 hour flight, 15 minutes to get situated, 45 minutes to destination). To drive that would take 21 hours and 1,400 mil…

$325 is a lot for a flight to miami, you can easily find flights that are half that.

Re: United removes first-class passenger to make room for 'higher-priority' traveler

#309

Post by moftz » Thu, Apr 13, 2017, 3:51 PM UTC

mpweiher wrote: post #69

shimon_e wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately, due to the economics of airline class[0], privileged passengers account for about 70% of airline revenue. 0. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BzB5xtGGsTc

Yes. I know where it's coming from. The airlines can't actually differentiate on the basic transportation service: you're in the same noisy metal tube traveling at exactly the same speed, arriving at the same time. There is some differentiation on the service you offer, bigger seats, maybe being able to lie flat. But that's about it, and since that's all there is the airlines just start making shit up. "Global Servic…

If I had the money, why wouldn't I want to fly first class and receive all the perks it entails? Hot towel? Don't mind if I do. Complimentary mimosa? Yes, please. I certainly can understand why some people choose to spend their money on first class tickets. The flight is more comfortable. The airlines wouldn't be able to offer these services to everyone on the plane unless they upped ticket prices. I, along with the majority of air travellers, feel comfortable enough in coach to not pay for all the extra service. I might pay for extra legroom but I understand why I'm paying extra for this service, I'm buying an extra fraction of the seats they weren't able to sell because they extended the legroom for X number of rows (plus additional money because they can).

Re: United removes first-class passenger to make room for 'higher-priority' traveler

#310

Post by jhulla » Thu, Apr 13, 2017, 3:52 PM UTC

imgabe wrote: post #281

jhulla wrote: post #248

Comment might be buried... But, the problem is the baroque overlaid combinations of [seat class, fare class, FF status, standby, cash vs FF purchase, time of arrival at gate, etc.] intersecting with [connecting flts, equipment, weather, etc.] leads to a large range of predictable conditions with uncertain outcomes. E.g. only one seat remaining, who gets it: passenger needing to make intl connection on a FF ticket or…

The other issue is to stop overbooking every single flight and allow some slack to handle these unexpected situations that inevitably come up.

Overbooking guarantees near 100% utilization. As you observed, it also leads to regular situations where a gate agent has to prioritize customers into limited slots. If overbooking and gate agents predictably end up destroying customer goodwill, then the practice has to be reconsidered.