Seven years ago I cofounded a genuine alternative platform to Google Ads (Publir). The company is doing remarkably well and we have many happy publishers (and users). Happy to answer questions here or via PM.
We’re dropping Google Ads
491–500 of 617 posts
Re: We’re dropping Google Ads
#492Earlier quoted context omitted.
When you enter a physical store or the house of your neighbours, you are also entering into an unspoken agreement that far exceeds the minimum requirements set by law. You didn't sign anything and no notice was posted, yet you abide by the rules. When they clearly and openly change those requirements, for instance by hanging advertisement banners from the walls, then you have the option of leaving. You are certainly…
If I could use magic shades (a They Live reference?) to block ads in real life I would, even if it hurt the feelings of some business people.
We're not that far from achieving that, from a tech point of view. Augmented reality with something like the Hololens could hide these things away, image recognition has become good enough to deal with most real world ads panels/posters. The main showstopper is size of equipment and battery life.
The day AR allows me to use a headset untethered to a desktop computer with enough battery life to last a day will be the last day I ever have to watch an ad in the real world.
Re: We’re dropping Google Ads
#493Earlier quoted context omitted.
If you know of a better means than google ads to do advertisements for a one person shop that isn't going to take enormous time away from producing content, I am all ears.
We don't use ads for the D programming language. What we do, and I've done in the past, is write articles about programming that are interesting in their own right, and that happen to use D: http://digitalmars.com/articles/ Pretty much all programming products, even free ones, operate this way. Much of the content you see on Hacker News, and on reddit/r/programming, is of this form. There are TV shows that do the sam…
That is basically my plan for my next website. But some problem spaces are not served well by that model. Also, I think there is a substantial learning curve for doing something like that well and not being borderline con artist.
Re: We’re dropping Google Ads
#494Earlier quoted context omitted.
Patreon has a rather large problem for poorer people. Patreon's insistance on taking the money on the 1st of the month is a pain because that is rent day for most people. A service that allowed a person to select a day (e.g. 12th) or better yet pick a day the way a lot of people get paid (day after third Thursday of the month) would be preferred. [edit] To give a concrete example. Suppose someone on Social Security w…
To be completely honest, if this is an issue, that person probably shouldn't be using patreon at all.
No. I don't think you get the problem. If I'm spending $10 or so on all these media and entertainment folks, the first day of the month might be bad, but the 20th or day after the 3rd Wednesday might be just fine. A lot of people living on fixed incomes or paycheck to paycheck manage their money closely. Given how banks work, a $1 charge at the wrong time is seriously problematic.
I realize SV never has to worry, but how about making it easier for janitor who cleans your building or the person making your coffee to participate in the digital economy?
Re: We’re dropping Google Ads
#495Earlier quoted context omitted.
You can also just do a tip jar model or patreon. So far, for me, the tip jar has been more successful than ads or Patreon (though I am new to Patreon, so, time will tell). I would be happy to get rid of ads altogether (with the exception of one site, for REASONS) if I thought that would drive up tips. But I have experimented a bit and it didn't seem to drive up tips. Then, whenever I read these discussions, there is…
Patreon has a rather large problem for poorer people. Patreon's insistance on taking the money on the 1st of the month is a pain because that is rent day for most people. A service that allowed a person to select a day (e.g. 12th) or better yet pick a day the way a lot of people get paid (day after third Thursday of the month) would be preferred. [edit] To give a concrete example. Suppose someone on Social Security w…
Patreon allows content produces to make content available for free while a subset of the audience pays for it. If you do it well, that subset gets additional benefits without leaving the larger audience out in the cold with hollow teasers and no real substance. Tip jars allow the same thing: For the content producer to make some money without charging a fee to poor people, who are free to access it.
I will always have ads on my homeless site so that homeless people do not feel like leeches. Traffic alone can put some money in my pocket. But, I would happily remove ads from other sites if I genuinely thought this would lead to a better outcome for me. I have done a lot of nice things for people online for a lot of years and mostly not been paid for it.
This is partly a function of the problem spaces that I am involved in. Some problems are inherently trickier than others. But it is partly a function of being a woman, which both cuts me out of the "old boy network" such that I have difficulty accessing pertinent knowledge and skills and also makes other people prone to thinking I should do it out of the goodness of my heart and my dire poverty is not their problem, which is all kinds of fucked up.
So, at this point, I am more concerned with figuring out how to line my empty pockets with money than I am with the criticisms of other people. They mostly haven't given a damn about what I need and I am at a point where I feel "Yeah, whatever. This resource can absolutely go away. You are not entitled to benefit from me while I get nothing back, assholes."
So, you know, if people want to give me solutions for how to get money in a "good" way that actually improves my bottom line, awesome. If people want to bust my chops about it, not really caring at this point. Being super giving and virtuous does not have a track record of keeping me fed.
Re: We’re dropping Google Ads
#496Earlier quoted context omitted.
You can also just do a tip jar model or patreon. So far, for me, the tip jar has been more successful than ads or Patreon (though I am new to Patreon, so, time will tell). I would be happy to get rid of ads altogether (with the exception of one site, for REASONS) if I thought that would drive up tips. But I have experimented a bit and it didn't seem to drive up tips. Then, whenever I read these discussions, there is…
> You can also just do a tip jar model or patreon. I've contemplated this kind of thing, but it feels like panhandling, and I'm reluctant to go there. I would do it if I thought I could do so tastefully and respectfully. I'm a (non-tech-related) "content producer," and I absolutely refuse to put up ads or be a shill or "native advertiser." Instead, I wrote a book, and if people want to support what I do, they can buy…
When I had donate buttons, I literally had someone tell me I was panhandling the internet. Tip jars are a better way to signal "It took work to create value here and compensation is appreciated." It has gotten a very different response from people.
I am glad your strategy is working for you. But, if you are interested:
http://micheleincalifornia.blogspot.com/2015/11/how-to-make-...
Re: We’re dropping Google Ads
#497Earlier quoted context omitted.
My attitude toward ad blockers was always "meh". I have the right to render your bits and bytes however I wish. Using an ad blocker is just modifying the rendering algorithm, much the same way as I could use a French to Russian translator, something that increases font sizes, or throwing on a custom stylesheet. I can write my own web browser, if I wish. Some percentage of users will use ad blockers, and businesses sh…
Not even about the bits/bytes/data to me. My eyeballs are not being loaned to you; my senses/attention is not for sale. I'm perfectly fine with paywalls - that's the 'correct' approach as far as I'm concerned. You can decide to conceal the information you know; if it's valuable and nonexcludable (usually isn't), then hey, you have a sale. But if you don't, don't expect your deals with third parties to hold up on some…
> My eyeballs are not being loaned to you; my senses/attention is not for sale.
That fine-sounding in theory, but it seems to ignore the fact that your attention has been for sale for as long as billboards, or, heck, carnival barkers have been around.
It's great that we can use technology to un-render ads that have been delivered to us via the internet, so I fully support ad blockers, but let's not pretend that we have some innate, natural Right to never hear a sales-pitch.
Re: We’re dropping Google Ads
#498Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't think anyone is seriously doubting your legal right to block ads. > If it is not sustainable, new business models will be invented. If the ad blocking becomes so widespread that the ad-supported model becomes unsustainable, I think a lot of people will be unhappy with what happens next. There will be a lot more paywalls and a lot more native advertising, which will be fine for entrenched players but much hard…
The cool thing about AdWords... ...is that a competing business down the road from mine has decided to spend $20/click for my business name , so now I have to spend much more than that in order for customers who already want to make an appointment with me to be able to call my phone number consistently. Google are complete gangster at this point... "nice business you have there."
Or you could hire an IP attorney to file a trademark infringement suit against that competing business?
How is that not intentionally causing marketplace confusion?
Also, if you roll over and pay Google, you are damaging your ability to defend your own business name as a trademark. Trademarks are lost if you don't defend them. Talk to a real lawyer, ASAP.
Re: We’re dropping Google Ads
#499Earlier quoted context omitted.
To be completely honest, if this is an issue, that person probably shouldn't be using patreon at all.
No. I don't think you get the problem. If I'm spending $10 or so on all these media and entertainment folks, the first day of the month might be bad, but the 20th or day after the 3rd Wednesday might be just fine. A lot of people living on fixed incomes or paycheck to paycheck manage their money closely. Given how banks work, a $1 charge at the wrong time is seriously problematic. I realize SV never has to worry, but…
You let such people participate by designing systems where content producers can make money without getting money from every individual.
I think you have a point, but perhaps you should submit it as a suggestion directly to Patreon. Second, I have tip jars so people can give once without making a monthly commitment. Monthly commitments are a serious burden for poor people.
I intentionally list dollar amounts of $1, $3 and $5 to solicit small sums so people who can't afford more than $1 feel okay about giving $1. The jar is set up so you can then enter a quantity if you want to give more, for example 2 Tips at $5 to leave a total of $10. Most people who tip leave me $5 or more. But I do sometimes get $1. (This is really about 67 cents for me, but I don't want to treat other poor people like charity cases. I think that actively creates problems.)
Re: We’re dropping Google Ads
#500Earlier quoted context omitted.
You can also just do a tip jar model or patreon. So far, for me, the tip jar has been more successful than ads or Patreon (though I am new to Patreon, so, time will tell). I would be happy to get rid of ads altogether (with the exception of one site, for REASONS) if I thought that would drive up tips. But I have experimented a bit and it didn't seem to drive up tips. Then, whenever I read these discussions, there is…
Probably wouldn't work for bigger companies or people who don't want to publicly reveal themselves as the owner of the site. There needs to be a personal element for that to be efficient
And larger companies can have a department devoted to developing quality advertising (or other solutions). Google ads tend to appeal to very small operations that need a plug and play solution to try to monetize their work.
I am still wrestling with the question. I like the progress I am seeing. It is a good trend for me. But it is far from a solved problem. However, for the traffic numbers etc that I have, I seem to do better than average.