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Visual explanation of the last Google Codejam 2017 question

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Re: Visual explanation of the last Google Codejam 2017 question

#3

Post by bitcharmer »

hartator wrote: post #2

I wonder if there is a real cause and effect relationship between being good at this kind of games and being a good coder. I suspect not.

This has been discussed here before: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9695102

I don't even bother replying to their recruiters any more. The interview process tells me more than enough about the company.

Re: Visual explanation of the last Google Codejam 2017 question

#5

Post by ovi256 »

hartator wrote: post #2

I wonder if there is a real cause and effect relationship between being good at this kind of games and being a good coder. I suspect not.

This is about hitting the high notes, as Joel Spolsky put it in his [post].

A lot of people are good software engineers and can wrote good software. To get Jeff Deans that write revolutionary software, we don't yet have a better method than training people in these abstract, very hard problems, making them compete and hoping for the best.

As much as we software engineers / computer scientists believe we are special snowflakes, this exact same method is applied to most STEM PhD to professor tracks, mathematics, classic music instrument players, [athletes], and what have you.

[post] https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2005/07/25/hitting-the-high-n...

[athletes] http://rittersp.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/Chambliss-Mun...

[musicians] http://www.nytimes.com/images/blogs/freakonomics/pdf/Deliber...

Re: Visual explanation of the last Google Codejam 2017 question

#6

Post by tedsanders »

hartator wrote: post #2

I wonder if there is a real cause and effect relationship between being good at this kind of games and being a good coder. I suspect not.

I suspect there is a real relationship. General intelligence is a real phenomenon. Being smart at one task indicates, though does not guarantee, that you'll be smart at another task.

This is of course a different question than whether this test provides maximum predictiveness of future success. But it seems obvious to me that the test provides some information. It's really hard for a variable to be completely non-informative.

Lastly, I think it's important for us to not be too defensive. I sense, perhaps incorrectly, that sometimes we don't want to give value to tests we are bad at, because doing so would imply we aren't as good as feel we are.

Re: Visual explanation of the last Google Codejam 2017 question

#7

Post by patrickmn »

ovi256 wrote: post #5
hartator wrote: post #2

I wonder if there is a real cause and effect relationship between being good at this kind of games and being a good coder. I suspect not.

This is about hitting the high notes, as Joel Spolsky put it in his [post]. A lot of people are good software engineers and can wrote good software. To get Jeff Deans that write revolutionary software, we don't yet have a better method than training people in these abstract, very hard problems, making them compete and hoping for the best. As much as we software engineers / computer scientists believe we are special s…

And, of course, being good at coding competitions doesn't mean that you're necessarily a good software engineer. The Jeff Deans are rare. "Hoping for the best" is pretty accurate.

Re: Visual explanation of the last Google Codejam 2017 question

#9

Post by user5994461 »

hartator wrote: post #2

I wonder if there is a real cause and effect relationship between being good at this kind of games and being a good coder. I suspect not.

It ensures they have the basic: writing code. That you can learn alone on your computer when you are 15. That's entry level developer.

The part where you make large software, working in teams, to serve real users, can only be learnt on a job.

These competitions are not looking for anything fancy. They recruit juniors, they'll be trained on the job.

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