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The Value of Ideas

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Re: The Value of Ideas

#91

Post by micaelwidell »

ccc3 wrote: post #23

This post is just plain wrong. Obviously it's tempting to get caught up in ideas and ignore execution, but saying ideas are flat-out worthless is simply being ignorant of history. A few examples: - Creating an assembly line to mass produce cars in the early 1900s was a good idea. It clearly wouldn't have gone anywhere without execution, but if Henry Ford had instead decided to execute flawlessly on a hand-painted roc…

Funny you should mention hand-painted rock business as a counter-example. I presume you haven't heard of the massive success of Pet Rocks? Basically the story I was told was that Gary Dahl had a bet with a few friends that he could sell any product, no matter how stupid or useless, with the right packaging and marketing. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pet_Rock

Re: The Value of Ideas

#92

Post by philwelch »

mynameishere wrote: post #28

Here's the world's worst opinion on movie making: here's the world's worst idea for a movie: Titanic. Can anybody name even a single, solitary reason--even one --why the story of the Titanic could be considered anything other than a fantastic idea for a movie? The only thing I can come up with is "It's been done (successfully) too many times already", but that actually disproves the general assertion. I mean--it's up…

I think it's good too. Consider other tragedies:

-Losing battles: Tricky to pull off. Michael Bay flubbed Pearl Harbor's execution, but being the victim of the Japanese doesn't match up to being the victim of hubris and ill-fated love. Losing a fight might work if it's Legendary Fight For Good Against Evil, like the (legendary) Alamo, but show me an Alamo movie that caught on as much as Titanic. If you want to see a battle, you want to see the good guys win. That's the instinctive human reaction to seeing people fight.

-The Hindenburg. Too many swastikas--the audience will get distracted and want the damn zeppelin to burn just because it has Nazi livery. Seriously, the Hindenburg would make an even better Titanic (you have the romantic lost era of zeppelins) if it wasn't for the fucking swastikas on the tailfins.

Re: The Value of Ideas

#94

Post by zeynel1 »

ccc3 wrote: post #57
jasonlotito wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

None of your examples detracts from what he is saying. Your suggestion comes down to level of success. Your examples only work if Henry Ford would be considered a failure if painted rocks didn't lead to as much success as cars did, despite the evidence that rocks, painted and unpainted, are still a market.

He concludes his post by saying: Ideas are worthless. Execution is everything. The only way that's true is if you consider success to be binary. Either you succeed or you fail. But level of success is important in terms of economic value and it is demonstrable that the idea is a factor in level of success.

And also to execute you need to have an idea. Idea and execution are not independent. Idea has value by definition because it is the starting point.

Re: The Value of Ideas

#95

Post by xiaoma »

micaelwidell wrote: post #91
ccc3 wrote: post #23

This post is just plain wrong. Obviously it's tempting to get caught up in ideas and ignore execution, but saying ideas are flat-out worthless is simply being ignorant of history. A few examples: - Creating an assembly line to mass produce cars in the early 1900s was a good idea. It clearly wouldn't have gone anywhere without execution, but if Henry Ford had instead decided to execute flawlessly on a hand-painted roc…

Funny you should mention hand-painted rock business as a counter-example. I presume you haven't heard of the massive success of Pet Rocks? Basically the story I was told was that Gary Dahl had a bet with a few friends that he could sell any product, no matter how stupid or useless, with the right packaging and marketing. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pet_Rock

It's still a much more limited business than the one Ford did create. Fifty years from now, the pet rock will be forgotten but Ford's assembly line will still be well known.

Re: The Value of Ideas

#96

Post by chmike »

I disagree with the author. Ideas are not worthless. It is just that execution has a much bigger impact on the result. Ideas are like seeds. Without seeds you can't get anything. But even with bad seeds one can get a good result with good ground and good caring. And very good seeds can be spoiled. Ideas are thus important, but not as much as execution. Considering them as worthless is wrong.

Re: The Value of Ideas

#97

Post by orborde »

sroerick wrote: post #43
mynameishere wrote: post #28

Here's the world's worst opinion on movie making: here's the world's worst idea for a movie: Titanic. Can anybody name even a single, solitary reason--even one --why the story of the Titanic could be considered anything other than a fantastic idea for a movie? The only thing I can come up with is "It's been done (successfully) too many times already", but that actually disproves the general assertion. I mean--it's up…

It's a romance story where everyone dies at the end. What's the target demographic? Guys? No, too much romance. Girls? No, too SFX heavy and everyone dies. Don't say James Cameron can't play to a crowd.

  It's a romance story where everyone dies at the end.
People seem to think "Romeo and Juliet" was pretty good.

Re: The Value of Ideas

#98

Post by mrvir »

timf wrote: post #11

Saying ideas are "worthless" is a hyperbolic way to put things. Why can't people say "an idea's relative importance is not as big as many people think." I think Derek Sivers puts it nicely, it is a multiplier (but yes you need to execute in the first place): http://sivers.org/multiply

Yes, provocative illustration, but very entertaining, I admit. The magic trick was to reduce every idea to one word or one sentence. Can be used to make any movie plot sound weird.

Re: The Value of Ideas

#99

Post by ajdecon »

moron4hire wrote: post #54
jimbokun wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I tried to think of a shitty idea with no potential market, and came up with 'beer that tastes like urine.' Then I realized Miller and Coors beat me to it." (trying to show the importance of the execution of an idea)

Okay, how about clothing that melts away when it gets wet? Got anything there?

If it's a lot cheaper than regular clothes, make it fashionable/slutty and call it disposable club-wear.

Re: The Value of Ideas

#100

Post by timwiseman »

infinite8s wrote: post #90
timwiseman wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You bring up an interesting topic. Is the idea of Freedom valuable with no execution? Freedom itself is almost priceless. I am well aware that the freedoms I enjoy now was bought with the blood of many who went before me. But that was the very costly execution that made freedom a reality. Is the idea, without tht execution to create freedome itself, of great value?

I believe it has great value if it inspires people to execute it.

Good point. With that said, the main value lies in having it and thus in the execution. The value of the idea itself without execution is only in inspiring people towards execution.
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