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Microsoft formally bans emulators on Xbox, Windows 10 download shops

arstechnica.com

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Re: Microsoft formally bans emulators on Xbox, Windows 10 download shops

#61

Post by throwanem »

the8472 wrote: post #54
throwanem wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I doubt they'll attempt to disable execution of web content based on some "this is probably an emulator" heuristic. On the one hand, that'd instantly be circumvented into negligibility; on the other, the backlash would be epic. I also severely doubt they'll attempt to prevent installation of application binaries from sources other than the Windows store. If anyone were going to be dumb enough to attempt such a move,…

Webcontent is not a free platform. It does not even give you sockets which can interact with arbitrary network services without centralized control (no, websockets don't work because they can't listen, webrtc does not work because it needs rendezvous servers). And neither can it access your own filesystem. It is quite locked down. In a way you get compute cycles, but you don't get access to the machine's full capabil…

I don't see where I made mention of any concept of freedom.

Re: Microsoft formally bans emulators on Xbox, Windows 10 download shops

#62

Post by goodplay »

throwanem wrote: post #47
izacus wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Until of course they disable installation from other sources than Windows Store in name of "malware protection and security". Boiling frogs and all that.

I doubt they'll attempt to disable execution of web content based on some "this is probably an emulator" heuristic. On the one hand, that'd instantly be circumvented into negligibility; on the other, the backlash would be epic. I also severely doubt they'll attempt to prevent installation of application binaries from sources other than the Windows store. If anyone were going to be dumb enough to attempt such a move,…

If people are willing to accept restrictions on what can be obtained or sold on the store (falsely in that name of "safety"), what makes you think they wont accept restrictions on what websites they are allowed to load, or more likely, what website owners are allowed to host?

Re: Microsoft formally bans emulators on Xbox, Windows 10 download shops

#63

Post by pjmlp »

douche wrote: post #10

I don't know about XBox, but does anybody actually use anything from the Windows Store? The only app that I have gotten is the SlingTV app, except I ditched it for the older native app, because the UWP Store one was so hideously broken and slow.

Yes, I have been slowly migrating to store apps, specially since they are sandboxed.

I also own a couple of WP, so I now get to use those apps on the desktop as well.

Re: Microsoft formally bans emulators on Xbox, Windows 10 download shops

#64

Post by mmcconnell1618 »

pjmlp wrote: post #59
mmcconnell1618 wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It really takes away from the good will I might have toward the Nintendo brand. My son wanted the new Zelda game for his wii u. He earned it and we got a download code from Amazon. One week later, Grandma bought him a Nintendo Switch. Guess which downloadable game only works on the Wii U? If we want the same game (downloadable too) for the Switch that will be another $60! When I buy a game on my iPhone 6, it works on…

The little facts you are ignoring is that Wii U and Switch aren't the same hardware, nor do they run the same OS.

Yes, different hardware. Yes, different OS. But when a new downloadable game is available on both platforms and is linked to my Nintendo account I expect I can play it on Nintendo hardware that supports the game without having to buy it twice. Switch even offers the concept of "Active Console" where all your switch downloads can be moved to different hardware.

Re: Microsoft formally bans emulators on Xbox, Windows 10 download shops

#65

Post by wpietri »

pmarreck wrote: post #46
TelmoMenezes wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure why the parent is being downvoted. Perhaps people don't like the read the truth, perhaps they are too young to remember a time of more computational freedom and openness. The majority of "computers" people own are already locked down, and it seems clear that things will only get worse -- hardware is increasingly opaque and designed to do things against the interest of the user (or, to say the least, without…

It's getting downvoted because there will always be open source OS'es that can run open-source emulators. Since all computers are also Turing machines. Dystopian reasoning in the 2 parent comments is slippery-slope fallacy.

I don't think "in theory you could be free, even if in practice you aren't" is much in the way of freedom.

Is there even a full open-source OS for the iPhone? If so, I have never once seen anybody using it. In practice, Apple has full control over the apps their users run, and they are not shy about using it. It has been 10 years, and this picture has been getting worse, not better.

Clearly other vendors have looked at that and said, "30% of tens of billions of dollars per year, plus the ability to screw over competitors? Yes please!"

This is definitely not the slippery-slope fallacy, because all he's really positing is that corporate control will continue to tighten at the current rate. If you want to demonstrate otherwise, you have to prove it. And I think the only thing you've proven so far is that there will always be a few greybeards willing to boot up an old Linux kernel on obsolete hardware, which does not sound like true freedom to me.

Re: Microsoft formally bans emulators on Xbox, Windows 10 download shops

#66

Post by Quequau »

ysavir wrote: post #7

I guess in 10-20 years we will be telling our grandchildren about the old days, where you can do whatever you want on your computer, limited only the abilities of the hardware* . And they won't believe us. *Simplification, of course.

This is something that Richard Stallman and Cory Doctorow have been warning about for some time now... The war against general purpose computing.

Re: Microsoft formally bans emulators on Xbox, Windows 10 download shops

#67

Post by cwyers »

izacus wrote: post #42
vlan0 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This really only affects distribution through the Windows Store, correct? I don't anything saying the execution of console emulation software is now impossible on Windows 10. While it is possible this is a slippery slope that leads to the case you are referring to. It's still not clear if it will ever reach that state.

Until of course they disable installation from other sources than Windows Store in name of "malware protection and security". Boiling frogs and all that.

I seriously doubt that Microsoft is going to ban, oh, just for starters:

* Photoshop * Illustrator * Premier * Avid * Office * Visual Studio

etc. etc. Legacy applications are a huge reason for people to use Windows. Blocking themselves off from that rich ecosystem of applications is basically begging people to use a Chromebook.

Re: Microsoft formally bans emulators on Xbox, Windows 10 download shops

#68

Post by vvanders »

izacus wrote: post #42
vlan0 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This really only affects distribution through the Windows Store, correct? I don't anything saying the execution of console emulation software is now impossible on Windows 10. While it is possible this is a slippery slope that leads to the case you are referring to. It's still not clear if it will ever reach that state.

Until of course they disable installation from other sources than Windows Store in name of "malware protection and security". Boiling frogs and all that.

Yeah, that'll happen when hell freezes over. The one thing Microsoft holds above all else is backwards compatibility and this would break that in a million ways.

Re: Microsoft formally bans emulators on Xbox, Windows 10 download shops

#69

Post by gdulli »

mmcconnell1618 wrote: post #52
izacus wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having to rebuy the license to pay the same game over and over and over again so you can play it on a slightly updated and still working hardware is downright Kafkaesque. Nintendo and other copyright holders want to act like you're licensing software (so they don't have to be beholden to first-sale doctrine, laws concerning the ability to make local backups and other consumer protections), but they also want to preve…

It really takes away from the good will I might have toward the Nintendo brand. My son wanted the new Zelda game for his wii u. He earned it and we got a download code from Amazon. One week later, Grandma bought him a Nintendo Switch. Guess which downloadable game only works on the Wii U? If we want the same game (downloadable too) for the Switch that will be another $60! When I buy a game on my iPhone 6, it works on…

There are reasons Nintendo has burned a ton of goodwill to the point where it made the difference in my not buying a Switch. But buying a game on one console generation and having it work on the next has rarely been the norm. Nintendo did decide at one point to pour a lot of separate money into developing the Wii U game for the Switch as well. There's a lot going on behind the scenes to make a game work on multiple consoles. And unfortunately when you buy a copy digitally you also lose the ability to sell or trade it, so I never do that.

I had the opposite experience with Apple. My iPhone 3 got unacceptably slow when the next major version of the OS came out. There were games/apps I couldn't use anymore unless I wanted to do a factory reset to the older OS. That was after only 2 years. I got off the platform a long time ago and haven't had that problem since.

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