Ride-hailing apps may help to curb drunk driving • Hacker News Board

Re: Ride-hailing apps may help to curb drunk driving

#121

Post by lsc » Thu, Apr 06, 2017, 6:38 AM UTC

m-j-fox wrote: post #112

metafunctor wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not quite as taboo as many other countries [1], unfortunately. You give two excuses to drink and drive. Both are indefensible. The first excuse is "need a car to get around, have car". I live in a sparsely populated area as well, and everyone uses a car to get around. When we go out drinking, we plan ahead. The most common options are designated drivers, taxis, sleeping over, walking, or cycling. The second excuse is…

Walking and cycling are going to get you killed at the same rate if not higher as driving. I guess you're not as likely to kill someone else.

Yup. I think that as a culture, we need to think more about the risks we take with other people's lives.

I think this is best demonstrated by the minimum liability insurance required to operate a car. In California, right now, you can drive a car with only $35K in liability insurance... which is crazy. Sure, that will cover most cars, but it won't even cover a moderate injury. Very few people have the assets required to pay for a serious injury, and therefore, the victim is usually under-compensated.

Right now, cars are essentially being subsidized by the people who are getting hurt who get under compensated, because few people have enough liability insurance (or assets) to cover the cost of really hurting someone. If the injuries per mile were better factored into the cost of driving (which could be done by increasing the liability insurance minimum) driving would be a lot more expensive; quite possibly, once you factor in injuries, other, safer forms of transport would start looking practical.

Re: Ride-hailing apps may help to curb drunk driving

#122

Post by doktrin » Thu, Apr 06, 2017, 6:39 AM UTC

sAbakumoff wrote: post #119

jhpaul wrote: post #65

Based on personal experiences this isn't surprising. When I was in college in a small town in the late 00's, many friends and acquaintances would drive across town after heavy drinking. 10-15 minutes, straight roads, little traffic. Other than not going out, or not getting home, you didn't have many options. It was a hour long walk or a $20-40 cab ride, if you could get one. I was recently back in town for a wedding…

During my first visit to the USA, back in 2007, I was shocked at casual drinking and driving habits of my co-workers. They were fine with having 5-6 bottles of beer and a couple of shots and then drop me in the hotel before driving home. Fortunately they don't have to do that anymore.

I rarely drive, but a lot of my colleagues did exactly what you describe. It's most definitely unsettling, and thankfully that's one particular behavior I've barely seen since the ride sharing services came on the scene.

Re: Ride-hailing apps may help to curb drunk driving

#123

Post by skrebbel » Thu, Apr 06, 2017, 6:54 AM UTC

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #105

metafunctor wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It has always amazed me how casually people drink and drive in some countries; the US especially springs to mind. Over here, drinking and driving is an extremely shameful and embarrassing thing to do. I would say it's on par with hitting a child. You just don't do it, not to save 20 bucks, or to save you from walking an hour.

It isn't that, the cab rides are never just $20, and often there are no cabs at all. The USA just has crappy non car transportation options. And it isn't just an hour walk in many places, but a few hours walk on dark streets with no side walks. When I was living in the Deep South, I sometimes had to take people home 20+ miles out in the middle of nowhere.

Makes sense, but if you know that your only way back home is your car and you still pop the cork, you're acting like a bad person in my book ("hitting a child" level indeed).

Re: Ride-hailing apps may help to curb drunk driving

#124

Post by ojilles » Thu, Apr 06, 2017, 6:55 AM UTC

Griffinsauce wrote: post #115

wapz wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 20+ miles out in the middle of nowhere That's the reason there are no cabs and I don't blame cab drivers. They don't get paid to sit around 40 minutes to find a passenger. I'm surprised that finding an uber in one of those places is not difficult either. Outside of the US, a lot of the population is very condensed (well the US is to some degree) making cabs and public transportation much more efficient/effective IM…

Sounds like a perfect case for autonomous cars. They don't have to be paid to wait.

They do, right? Needs to be depreciated.

Re: Ride-hailing apps may help to curb drunk driving

#125

Post by posguy » Thu, Apr 06, 2017, 6:56 AM UTC

Griffinsauce wrote: post #115

wapz wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 20+ miles out in the middle of nowhere That's the reason there are no cabs and I don't blame cab drivers. They don't get paid to sit around 40 minutes to find a passenger. I'm surprised that finding an uber in one of those places is not difficult either. Outside of the US, a lot of the population is very condensed (well the US is to some degree) making cabs and public transportation much more efficient/effective IM…

Sounds like a perfect case for autonomous cars. They don't have to be paid to wait.

Gas, wear and tear & depreciation aren't free though, these are always going to be higher cost areas to serve.

Re: Ride-hailing apps may help to curb drunk driving

#126

Post by IanCal » Thu, Apr 06, 2017, 7:00 AM UTC

nikcub wrote: post #59

username223 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps, but don't call it "sharing," because sharing is reciprocal. If it were actually sharing, you would be driving for Uber as much as the people who chauffeur you around. Call them what they are: unlicensed taxis. Also, "the general willingness of people to embrace the gig economy" is just another way of saying "many people are desperate enough to do sub-minimum-wage piecework."

> because sharing is reciprocal. This didn't sound right so I looked it up[0] No mention of it being reciprocal - which makes sense for almost every use of "sharing" I can think of When I share my sandwich I'm not receiving any other sandwich from anybody else (perhaps if I was I'd share more often) Anyway, its not easy to defend Uber and I don't want to be labeled that way - since I've boycotted the service more tha…

I agree that reciprocal doesn't really describe it.

Perhaps the concept they were trying to get at is that sharing suggests everyone involved is getting the same thing in some way. If I share a ride with you, it's because we're both going the same way. What's actually happening with uber is we each want something different. They want my money, and I want to be taken somewhere.

It is, however, an highly successful branding exercise.

Re: Ride-hailing apps may help to curb drunk driving

#127

Post by IanCal » Thu, Apr 06, 2017, 7:04 AM UTC

strictnein wrote: post #102

jryle70 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is disingenuous at best. Before Uber, how many of those "independent contractors" were in the market? It's fair to criticize Uber's aggressive and shady practices, it's also fair to acknowledge the enormous changes that it has brought about to the transportation landscape.

Actually most taxi drivers are independent contractors, which makes it even clearer that Uber added something to the equation, and always makes it kind of funny how upset people are about Uber drivers not being full time employees. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2015/10/29/labor...

I'm happy with uber having contractors, workers or employees (three distinct categories in the UK). What I'm not happy with is them picking and choosing the parts of those definitions which benefit themselves.

I don't think it's particularly amusing to be upset at a multi-billion dollar company trying to skirt employment laws.

Re: Ride-hailing apps may help to curb drunk driving

#128

Post by deftturtle » Thu, Apr 06, 2017, 7:04 AM UTC

How is this even up for speculation? Why is there a need to quantify this with a study? Of course it curbs drunk driving. When you have better options, they're used.

Re: Ride-hailing apps may help to curb drunk driving

#129

Post by manarth » Thu, Apr 06, 2017, 7:08 AM UTC

kneel wrote: post #99

metafunctor wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It has always amazed me how casually people drink and drive in some countries; the US especially springs to mind. Over here, drinking and driving is an extremely shameful and embarrassing thing to do. I would say it's on par with hitting a child. You just don't do it, not to save 20 bucks, or to save you from walking an hour.

>It has always amazed me how casually people drink and drive in some countries; the US especially springs to mind. Drinking and driving is still very taboo in the US. It's just that most areas of the country require an automobile to get around and most people have a car. One more thing, no one should be surprised that people drink and drive anywhere. People make all sorts of terrible decisions when they're intoxicate…

  > no one should be surprised that people drink and drive anywhere.
  > People make all sorts of terrible decisions when they're intoxicated

Many people make a Ulysses pact: if they're going out drinking, they make the decision whilst sober to leave the car at home, removing any temptation to use it to get home later when they're drunk.

Re: Ride-hailing apps may help to curb drunk driving

#130

Post by qyv » Thu, Apr 06, 2017, 7:09 AM UTC

jnordwick wrote: post #78

qyv wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not he accessibility of ride-sharing services that is doing this, it is the ride-sharing services policy of artificially low pricing to facilitate rapid growth that is responsible. Those $9 rides are not sustainable. When the prices go back up to sustainable levels we will see many of these benefits evaporate.

And like you know, all the other things he listed: > it's easy to call one from a crowded/loud place, you know how much it will cost, they don't use cash, they know where you are, and you don't have to give directions. p.s., why do people like you want to hate on ride sharing services so much? Is it just that nothing can ever be good enough in your mind?

> And like you know, all the other things he listed: >> it's easy to call one from a crowded/loud place, you know how much it will cost, they don't use cash, they know where you are, and you don't have to give directions.

Subjective advantages which are not exclusive nor intrinsic to ride sharing services. They can be replicated by anyone in the industry if they are deemed as valuable to their business. I never denied they don't add value (for some), I'm saying that it is the hugely undercut pricing that is primarily driving this trend.

> p.s., why do people like you want to hate on ride sharing services so much? Is it just that nothing can ever be good enough in your mind?

Wow, generalize much? Who is "people like you" exactly? The answer to you question is pretty obvious if you put the snark aside: My problem is with the predatory pricing that companies like Uber are using. when I said their pricing is not sustainable that is exactly what I meant. In 5 years they will either be gone or will have raised their prices.